Vista helpless

[admin]

News from MS: "Windows Help program (WinHlp32.exe) is no longer included with Windows [Vista]" -- http://support.microsoft.com/kb/917607/en-us

We strongly recommend that software developers stop using the Windows Help application in Windows Vista. Software developers who ship programs that rely on .hlp files are encouraged to transition their Help experience to an alternative Help file format, such as .chm, .html, or .xml. You will also have to change your calls from the WinHelp() API to the new content source. Several third-party tools are available to help authors in converting content from one format to the other. The WinHelp.exe program is a version of Windows Help designed for 16-bit .hlp files. The WinHelp.exe program will continue to be included with Windows Vista.

Hum hum. Unexpected extra work, great!
Personally, I find all help formats suck, be it hlp or chm or xml or html -- they are ugly, nonintuitive, slow etc. Unforunately I have no time to invent a good help, so I have to take what's there.

I would be thankful for any suggestions concerning:
- the preferred format of XY's future help
- software that helps me converting the help from hlp to ???
- software that helps me editing the help in future

Of course, the question wiki-to-offlinesomething comes into play again... if this would work, i.e. if it would result into something that's really usable and quick --- would be great!

[lukescammell]

Of course, the question wiki-to-offlinesomething comes into play again... if this would work, i.e. if it would result into something that's really usable and quick --- would be great!

This would be the best answer, as then the Help would be kept up to date by other people easing the workload on you Someone must be working on a Wiki -> Help file setup...

[j_c_hallgren]

Question: Is the current .HLP in a 16-bit or 32-bit format? And what are the restrictions on 16-bit? As it says that 16-bit will still be possible, as I read it...yes, it's ancient, but compatible with everyone!

If switching is needed, I'd go with .CHM, as other formats don't seem to provide as good/easy a method for searching for a item/topic...I have some software that uses a HTML help, and thus has multiple files instead of one...which causes some false hits when searching for a file!

Having the wiki is nice, but as it can be altered by us, I wouldn't suggest having it as the primary doc, so having the "official" doc authored by Don makes more sense...plus...not everyone is ONLINE when one needs help! The wiki works by expanding on the help and providing alternate text that some may understand easier.

[RalphM]

- the preferred format of XY's future help
- software that helps me converting the help from hlp to ???
- software that helps me editing the help in future

Ever heard of Robohelp?
Never used it myself but heard talk about it in a project I was involved.

[pissant]

I hate Vista so much, and it hasn't even been released yet. Why the hell so many people have bulges in their shorts over it is beyond me.

I also hate most help file formats, but especially HLP.

Why not simply use HTML? If HTML is done well, it's very easy to use, and can be easily mirrored online. That way, users have the option of using the online verison of help, to ensure that they're seeing the latest changes/additions/corrections.

[admin]

I hate Vista so much, and it hasn't even been released yet. Why the hell so many people have bulges in their shorts over it is beyond me.

I also hate most help file formats, but especially HLP.

Why not simply use HTML? If HTML is done well, it's very easy to use, and can be easily mirrored online. That way, users have the option of using the online verison of help, to ensure that they're seeing the latest changes/additions/corrections.

Fully acknowledged!

[j_c_hallgren]

HTML help files have some advantages, but I've only found disadvantages myself:
1) Typically uses/creates multiple sub-folders with dozens/hundreds of files...thus more files to search and get false matches on due to names...with HLP or CHM, there is usually only one file for the application.
2) Opens a normal browser window which I may not want at that time...the HLP window has a unique icon so I can easily spot it
3) No provison for index based on typed input, so one can locate item easily...and then providing choices if multiple options
4) Keeping HTML Help 'on top' not quite as easy to do, if at all
5) Can't define bookmarks for just that help file as one can do in HLP
6) Also, can't annotate the topics as in HLP
7) HLP files have a unique history so not mixed in with other browser data

These are some of the reasons I much prefer having any help in its own format.

[lukescammell]

6) Also, can't annotate the topics as in HLP

You can do this? Learn something every day...

[cajhin]

Well, if you like it or not, Vista will be here soon. One of the things MS did right IMO: they dropped that awful .hlp format from the 80's.
Why use it, when there is something nice like .chm?

I've never created one myself, but from a user perspective it is the help style I like best. From what I've heard it is easy to create and maintain.
Back in the NT4 days, I had to use DocToHelp and RoboHelp for several projects. Awful, awful software... (a messy plugin/hack for Word, basically). Too expensive for what you want to do anyway.

One option _I_ would look into: write in Treepad, then use the 3rd party chm converter. Treepad is cool, it's just a joy to use.

One way to structure all the stuff:

Installation
I'd put it into a seperate txt file. When you click on a program's Help menu, chances are you won't need install instructions...

Intro, Hello, Warm words
It is already on your homepage. You might include it with the help, if XYP is frequently downloaded somewhere else, where the intro is not on the download page.

Quick, bare-bones Reference (What does ___ do ?)
List of ALL Menu items, keyboard shortcuts, config options. Keep it brief (or you won't keep it up to date...). Context sensitive links.

Guides and Tips (How do I ___ ?)
I'd use the wiki for that; keep the help tight.

Legal & Blah
Seperate .txt file, out of the way. Does anyone ever read that?

On-screen help
For some special items, like the RegEx-Rename panel, it would be good to have help directly in the program; either a popup or written on the panel itself. Looking up the syntax is part of the workflow for 95% of the users, I guess.

A cheap alternative would be plain HTML; in that case, I'd prefer a single page with a table of contents on top.

[lukescammell]

A cheap alternative would be plain HTML; in that case, I'd prefer a single page with a table of contents on top.

I can see where you're coming from on this one, but it would be a bit of a beast no?

[petroffp]

http://www.helpandmanual.com/index.html
Easy to use. Outputs to lot's of formats.
Pro version has searchable HTML help feature

[Statler]

HelpMaker.

It can produce HLP, CHM, HTML and RTF, it's easy to use (after only a couple of hours I had written my first CHM), doesn't have too many bugs (at least no serious bugs I'm aware of), and the best of all: it's totally free, even for commercially use.

Just my 2 Euro cents.

[admin]

Good conversion from HLP to CHM would be what I need. Good means: no bugs, no crashes, keep the original look (fonts, colors etc) as much as possible.

I tried a couple of products but they were not good.

Is "Help & Manual" or "HelpMaker" good?

[Statler]

Good conversion from HLP to CHM would be what I need. Good means: no bugs, no crashes, keep the original look (fonts, colors etc) as much as possible.

I tried a couple of products but they were not good.

Is "Help & Manual" or "HelpMaker" good?

I can't speak of "Help & Manual" as I've never used it. I like "HelpMaker" because it's easy to learn and more important it's free. But AFAIK it can't convert your HLP to CHM. It would mean to start a new project and copy and paste your files into that.

I did some more digging in the net and I came up with these sites which might be interesting for you:
http://www.mshelpwiki.com/
and about the conversion from HLP to CHM:
http://www.help-info.de/en/Help_Info_Wi ... erting.htm

[admin]

Good conversion from HLP to CHM would be what I need. Good means: no bugs, no crashes, keep the original look (fonts, colors etc) as much as possible.

I tried a couple of products but they were not good.

Is "Help & Manual" or "HelpMaker" good?

I can't speak of "Help & Manual" as I've never used it. I like "HelpMaker" because it's easy to learn and more important it's free. But AFAIK it can't convert your HLP to CHM. It would mean to start a new project and copy and paste your files into that.

I did some more digging in the net and I came up with these sites which might be interesting for you:
http://www.mshelpwiki.com/
and about the conversion from HLP to CHM:
http://www.help-info.de/en/Help_Info_Wi ... erting.htm

Thanks. I knew the Help_Info_WinHelp link. It teached me how shockingly complex and tedious Converting WinHelp (HLP) to HTMLHelp (CHM) would be. It really stops you wanting to do it!

I've tried many great looking help systems and, believe me, they all sucked! It started to feel like buying a used car when I finally gave up and did it the hard way using MS Word and MS Help Compiler.

From that experience I have to say: I'm only interested in tips that come from prolonged and professional personal experience with the recommended help software. (Astroturfers, go home! )