Option for Live Filter Box instead of Type Ahead Find

[photoman]

I just tried this. First of all I'd like to say... WOW!!!! TOTALLY AWESOME!
My fingers feel so happy. And I am navigating through folders blazingly fast now and it feels great. It's a huge difference.

Backspace - I like the implementation you have now where it deletes characters in the LFB, and then when it's empty it moves up a directory. My fingers feel very at ease with this. It's also very logical when you travel into a folder, because when you enter the folder, the LFB becomes empty as we expect, and my mind is not in LFB mode, so I expect backspace to bring me back up to the parent. So I definitely like it, because backspace works the way I've always used it to go up to the parent.

Another Minor Tweak if you want::
Instead of showing the "This view is empty. xxx items don't match the current filter" message, you could instead have that last keystroke not register as a valid key and leave the search state at the last valid key. I believe this is more useful. Not much value comes from typing a wrong character, seeing the message and no files in the list box, and then having to backspace out. Especially if you type quickly and go a few keystrokes in before you see the mistake.
Example::
Files in the folder:
----------
jack1.txt
jack2.txt
Jackson1.txt
----------
LFB: You type "jakson" accidentally. Now you have to figure out where your mistake is and then "carefully" backspace back through "kson" and not go further. It's faster to have the 'j' and 'a' register as normal, and then when you type 'k', 's', 'o', ... you notice that nothing is happening and so you slow down for a second, glance at the LFB seeing only 'ja' and not care about why and assume you mistyped, and simply try again with the correct letter 'c' and continue.

Without seeing your code, I imagine a scenario where this could be pretty easy to implement because wherever you have the code to display that message, you could put the logic in for removing the last keystroke from the edit box instead, or something like that.

[TheQwerty]

Very nice addition!

And as a tweak (default = off)? Then everybody can decide for himself about if he's trembling in fear?
That's such a good navigation thing (and of course, only if the lfb is empty)^^

Let's wait if there are some more opinions on this...

OK, I decided to risk some fear and confusion experimentally. I saw that once you start controlling the list via LFB there grows a strong expectation that BACKSPACE also works as in the list.

I'm torn on this. It feels natural but it is too easy to go up when trying to clear the LFB. I think it might be better if you forced a delay between deleting the last character and treating the next backspace(s) as navigation.

[admin]

@photoman: Only after browsing I will know whether the view will be totally empty. And only then I could go back to the previous state which would trigger browsing again. Hmm, I find this a bit uncool and also uber-smart.

[admin]

Very nice addition!

And as a tweak (default = off)? Then everybody can decide for himself about if he's trembling in fear?
That's such a good navigation thing (and of course, only if the lfb is empty)^^

Let's wait if there are some more opinions on this...

OK, I decided to risk some fear and confusion experimentally. I saw that once you start controlling the list via LFB there grows a strong expectation that BACKSPACE also works as in the list.

I'm torn on this. It feels natural but it is too easy to go up when trying to clear the LFB. I think it might be better if you forced a delay between deleting the last character and treating the next backspace(s) as navigation.

OK, not bad. I will apply a minimal delay now: as long as the last filtering is not completed (tweak LiveFilterDelay) the back button will not do anything.

Apropos LiveFilterDelay. I use 300 msec and I'm happy with it. I wonder if I should not make this the factory default?

[photoman]

@TheQwerty
That is a legitimate concern. I don't know what kind of muscle memory your fingers have so you might have this problem. But, in my case for clearing the LFB, my fingers just simply tap the Escape key and all the letters are gone, so I don't have that problem. Also, if you backspace too many times, hitting enter gets your right back into the folder. If you backspace 2 or 3 too many times, pressing enter 2 or 3 times gets you back into the folder you exited mistakenly.

@admin
Yeah, that makes it a little harder than the "one line modification" I was imagining. For me, the current implementation is not a big slowdown. I think if I see the "view is empty" message, I'll just hit Escape and start typing again. It's probably faster than "debugging" my search inputted into LFB. Trying it out a few times already, my fingers seem happy with that so far.

[TheQwerty]

Apropos LiveFilterDelay. I use 300 msec and I'm happy with it. I wonder if I should not make this the factory default?

Not sure on an exact value but I feel the default should probably be non-zero.

That is a legitimate concern. I don't know what kind of muscle memory your fingers have so you might have this problem.

Depends on how many characters I've typed, but I generally do Backspace or Ctrl+Backspace - the latter does not trigger navigation. Indeed, it's easy to recover from but can cause a slight bit of disorientation at first. In some respects leaving this an "issue" might be okay as it increases the chances of the user discovering the capabilities.

[admin]

Yeah, that makes it a little harder than the "one line modification" I was imagining. For me, the current implementation is not a big slowdown. I think if I see the "view is empty" message, I'll just hit Escape and start typing again. It's probably faster than "debugging" my search inputted into LFB. Trying it out a few times already, my fingers seem happy with that so far.

You as a heavy keyboard user, what do you think of the LiveFilterDelay? It's a tweak that works like this:
When you set LiveFilterDelay=400, then the Live Filter is applied 400 msecs after the last key stroke. So when you type faster than 400 msecs per stroke you can type your pattern without any reload of the list while your are typing.
How to tweak: https://www.xyplorer.com/faq-topic.php?id=tweak

(I will probably raise this setting to GUI soon.)

[photoman]

Yeah, that makes it a little harder than the "one line modification" I was imagining. For me, the current implementation is not a big slowdown. I think if I see the "view is empty" message, I'll just hit Escape and start typing again. It's probably faster than "debugging" my search inputted into LFB. Trying it out a few times already, my fingers seem happy with that so far.

You as a heavy keyboard user, what do you think of the LiveFilterDelay? It's a tweak that works like this:
When you set LiveFilterDelay=400, then the Live Filter is applied 400 msecs after the last key stroke. So when you type faster than 400 msecs per stroke you can type your pattern without any reload of the list while your are typing.
How to tweak: https://www.xyplorer.com/faq-topic.php?id=tweak

(I will probably raise this setting to GUI soon.)

For the way I work, I don't want a delay. I like the feedback of each key being pressed and I like the fact that the list is getting smaller and smaller and I'm getting closer and closer to what I'm looking for. It's a very good tactile feel that helps me work faster.
I use another program called Locate32 (it indexes all files on the hard drive for searching) that actually reloads the list and has a setting for a delay. In that program I set a 200ms delay and the reason is because it actually reloads the list. What I mean is, you can see the list getting cleared and then repopulated and it flashes the screen and distracts the eyes and doesn't feel good. But even then, I figured out 200ms is all I wanted for delay which is almost no delay at all and I'd rather have speed even with a tiny bit of very minor eye discomfort.
Your program however, doesn't have this flashing. The list doesn't look like it's getting reloaded, even in a folder with a few thousand files. It looks like files are disappearing getting you closer and closer to your goal. And that has a good feeling, and the immediate feedback without delay is rewarding.

[klownboy]

Hi Don, I like nearly everything about the LFB controls added, but I have one concern. If the user has "Redirect typing to Live Filter Box" checked and the filter box is present on the display (i.e., the layout includes LFBShowFilter=1 and ShowStatusbar=1) everything is fine, but if the user has a layout which does not include the LFB or Status bar, when you begin typing should the LFB appear automatically as it does now (i.e., override the layout) even though it's not on the current layout. Maybe there should be a sub option for that Redirect typing option for, "Only if LFB is present". So if the LFB is not present in the current layout, the typing as an option, would result in type ahead find even if the Redirect typing...option is checked. Thanks.

[admin]

I'd prefer a decision to an option. Any votes?

[klownboy]

I would think that most people, including me, would probably have the LFB on with the status bar the majority of the time on most layouts. So if you simply had the "Redirect typing..." option only work if the LFB was ON or displayed that shouldn't be a problem. If LFB is not ON. then you would get type ahead find. Another way to look at it would be, why should "Redirect typing to LFB" work if you don't have LFB. But, you need to hear from others. Thanks.

[klownboy]

Don, obviously I could learn to live with it the way you set it and I realize you mentioned that in the release notes. Given the fact that with "Redirect typing..." option ticked, the LFB activates on typing, would be it be possible to have the second press of "Esc" remove the LFB. It actually kind of makes sense since you now have it activated /displayed automatically when you type anyway. So the first "Esc" clears the LFB and the list contents go back to normal. A second press of "Esc" removes the LFB and Status bar if it wasn't displayed previously. If you want to live filter again, you just start typing...it would be more of an on demand type feature that way. You don't have to see the Live Filter Box when it's not being used. What do you think?

[SkyFrontier]

LFB fails on branch-view for folders+files, letting all folders pass as far as I can tell.

[autocart]

LFB fails on branch-view for folders+files, letting all folders pass as far as I can tell.

I observed the same. I remember it now.

[admin]

That's a Branch View Setting: Configuration | Find Files & Branch View | Branch View | Let folders pass all filters