XYplorer Beta Club

I have only a vague idea about synchronization and what sorts of commands are useful and expected. So, here is your chance to wish for a command. Please try to deliver your wish in the style of the current Sync Tools commands:

Catchy Caption
One-line description of what will happen.

Please: I am not interested in theory! I can google myself and come up with hundreds of synchronization operations. I'm only interested in real demand from users who actually have work to do and could need a command to increase their everyday efficiency.

Firstly thanks for Sync Tools, they work already pretty fine.


One need of mine is to execute an command for both panes the same time. (At least for 1 +2)
Something like holding CTRL while double clicking or OKing?

So i would see by one CTRL+DoubleClick at 2 all orphans on both panes.
.

Stefan wrote:Firstly thanks for Sync Tools, they work already pretty fine.


One need of mine is to execute an command for both panes the same time. (At least for 1 +2)
Something like holding CTRL while double clicking or OKing?

So i would see by one CTRL+DoubleClick at 2 all orphans on both panes.
.

I'd rather have new commands for this. Holding CTRL will get confusing when it does not make sense for every command in the list.

But hey, I like "Orphans"! Maybe I swallow everything I said last time and call #2:
Select Orphans: Select all items not matching the items listed in the other pane.

Yours would be
Select Orphans (Both Panes): Select all items not matching the items listed in the respective other pane.


BTW, I'm not only waiting for Select commands, but actually for Copy commands...

Caption: Sync selected
Command: Syncs selected files from other pane with current pane.

It works exactly like backup command, just that it fits well within the context of sync tools

And we already discussed this:

Caption: Sync scrollbar
Command: Syncs current pane's list position with other pane, such that both panes scroll together.

admin> I'd rather have new commands for this.

Fine. EDIT: that would be too much entries. Maybe better an check box?

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admin>But hey, I like "Orphans"!

Pretty fine.

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admin>BTW, I'm not only waiting for Select commands, but actually for Copy commands...

I have also thought about additional features, (mine was "Files/Folders only")
but i think we have already such commands we can execute before and after "Sync Tool" ?

But wait..., what we not have is copy in sense of syncing:

Copy Orphans
Copy other pane missing items to other pane

Copy Orphans (Both Panes)
Copy each pane missing items to respective other pane


But on an second thought i would forget the "Copy" items
but add an second command to execute after the selection like "Sync: start copying now to each pane"
as addition to copy the selected first from pane1 to 2, switch and then copy from 2 to 1.

I think we have already all c/m/b commands. Even create an report is possible.
Sync Tool is in my eyes an tool just for selecting the right files.
But i will take some more time to think about this...


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And while trying to remember my weekly needs:

Select newer
Select all matching but newer items

Select bigger
Select all matching but bigger items

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And then i have the idea to add check boxes in front of all this possibilities to execute more then one simultaneous:
[ ] Select Matching (same in both)
[ ] Select Missing (in active pane)
[X] Select Orphans (in active pane)
[X] Select Newer (in active pane)
[ ] Select Bigger (in active pane)
[ ] Select Selected (from inactive pane)
[ ] Select same name (in active pane) but different attributes (then in inactive pane)
[ ] Invert above meaning to "Select NOT xxx"
[X] Act on Files
[X] Act on Folders
[X] Exclude Extension from comparing
[ ] Ignore common time differences as set in ini (?here ini settings displayed? like "2sec | 1;2;6hours")
[X] Act on both panes the same time
[ ] Hide non-selected (Set an VF afterwards to set focus on the important items only) and then un-select all
[ OK ]



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EDIT:
ideas for other wording (and for me to see what i need):
Select Same Items (same in both panes)
Select Missing Items (missing here what is in other pane)
Select Orphans Items (additional here what is missing in other pane)
Select Selected Items (select the same items as in other pane)



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EDIT:

How far will you go?
For an good result of different items we will also need some settings:
Ignore time differences under n seconds = 2
Ignore time differences of exactly n hours = 1;2;6

Maybe as INI parameter?


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Will focus on this later this day (very busy right now), but one weird idea that no sync tool ever offered me was a Select/Copy from Clipboard: I could (basket-like) play around and produce a list (via Ditto, Yankee Clipper or manually - or even better, having XY storing such list via CKS, but this is the principle of a basket operation, so...) which later could be used to produce a forced sync operation to one or both panes at a single stroke.
Also, (this one being more orthodox) I could Select/Copy the latest/older than [Predefined via Tweak/config = "X" min/hours/days] , with parameters like modification/creation/last accessed dates.

My sync needs are currently met by SyncBackSE, which has a different focus than XYplorer. Nevertheless:
1. Will Sync be limited to a single level of files/folders or will it recurse, allowing changes in an entire (sub)tree to be synced?
2. The sync method I use the most is mirror right, as SyncBackSE calls it (pulling in the changes from another computer), followed by literal syncing: merging changes made on the two PC's.
3. Probably outside the scope for XYplorer, but SyncBackSE allows *storing* advanced selections (include, exclude, include future new files) several levels deep. I have several subfolders in a folder I want to exclude from syncing; I'm sure others have their requirements. Still, a bit much probably.
4. Finally and OT, but I sync over a wireless network. For that purpose, the combined Sync and verification of XYcopy 2.0 should be awesome.

I have updated my collection post above:

- reorder the possible dialog layout
- add time and attrib diff

.

The one thing that I'd add to Stephan's list of options would be a simple pair of strings that would be considered equal for matching so that "Copy DSNB1175.jpg" and "Original dscb1175.jpg" could have "Copy" = "Original" as being identical.

Thanks folks, overwhelming as always.

I envisioned Sync Tools as an add-on to the Dual Pane feature, it's not about synching computers but just about comparing and synching what's currently shown in both panes. Maybe not even recursing the contents subfolders, not sure yet.

Surely I don't want to emulate BeyondCompare or SyncBackSE or similar, and given the diversity of possible sync actions you have shown me, this strikes me as a good idea:

Stefan wrote:I think we have already all c/m/b commands. Even create an report is possible.
Sync Tool is in my eyes an tool just for selecting the right files.

"Sync Tools" would then be a misnomer probably...

Now if you tell me "Hey, 90% of all sync action is Sync Panes (both way backup overwriting older files)" then I would add that command, of course... I simply don't know what people do most of the time when they sync. I don't sync myself.

admin wrote:Thanks folks, overwhelming as always.

That's what we are good for!

I envisioned Sync Tools as an add-on to the Dual Pane feature, it's not about synching computers but just about comparing and synching what's currently shown in both panes. Maybe not even recursing the contents subfolders, not sure yet.

I agree based on my experiance with x2 which is what I used mostly prior to finding XY...

Surely I don't want to emulate BeyondCompare or SyncBackSE or similar,
... I simply don't know what people do most of the time when they sync. I don't sync myself.

I use SyncBackSE but usually for different purposes than I'd use XY sync...however, what I'd suggest emulating would be the sync features of x2 which I see as a close competitor to XY so as to better capture/convert any user of that (or other FM) product...

There are times when SyncBackSE would likely do what I'd need but it can be a overkill in setup for a simple sync of a couple of folders to locate orphan files/folders and copy/move/delete them as needed.

Addendum:
Just looked at x2 help file...there it's part of a "Mark" menu.
And it uses a checkbox pop-up with a couple of drop-down items to select how panes should be compared and selected.

Stefan wrote:And then i have the idea to add check boxes in front of all this possibilities to execute more then one simultaneous:
[ ] Select Matching (same in both)
[ ] Select Missing (in active pane)
[X] Select Orphans (in active pane)
[X] Select Newer (in active pane)
[ ] Select Bigger (in active pane)
[ ] Select Selected (from inactive pane)
[ ] Select same name (in active pane) but different attributes (then in inactive pane)
[ ] Invert above meaning to "Select NOT xxx"
[X] Act on Files
[X] Act on Folders
[X] Exclude Extension from comparing
[ ] Ignore common time differences as set in ini (?here ini settings displayed? like "2sec | 1;2;6hours")
[X] Act on both panes the same time
[ ] Hide non-selected (Set an VF afterwards to set focus on the important items only) and then un-select all
[ OK ]

A very powerful approach with endless possibilities, BUT: not very usable I'm afraid. Who likes to scan and un/tick a dozen checkboxes before pressing OK? I will leave this level of granularity to the specialized apps.

admin wrote:A very powerful approach with endless possibilities, BUT: not very usable I'm afraid. Who likes to scan and un/tick a dozen checkboxes before pressing OK? I will leave this level of granularity to the specialized apps.

Who likes to do it? Well, me for one as a sometimes still user of x2 Lite with this pop-up: If I were a full time user of x2 and wanted to convert to XY, I'd probably expect to have this level of sync available as a minimum and also be fully used to dealing with this checkbox option...which does retain last used values so in many cases, one just has to "Enter"/OK to accept it.

admin wrote: A very powerful approach with endless possibilities,
BUT: not very usable I'm afraid.
Who likes to scan and un/tick a dozen checkboxes before pressing OK?
I will leave this level of granularity to the specialized apps.

I for my part would think an SyncTool without a bit of granularity is not very useful most of the time.
And, mostly you can just use your default setup and immediately click OK, if you want this quicker.

Stefan wrote:And then i have the idea to add check boxes in front of all this possibilities to execute more then one simultaneous:

For an compromise maybe I would remove
[X] Act on Files
[X] Act on Folders
[ ] different attributes

and implement
[ ] Hide non-selected Items
as an default command anyway (not related to ST only)
I am wondering this command is not already there... i am sure i just miss it?
I think it's like calling VF with selected items pre-selected ?

j_c_hallgren wrote:If I were a full time user of x2 and wanted to convert to XY, I'd probably expect to have this level of sync available as a minimum and also be fully used to dealing with this checkbox option...which does retain last used values so in many cases, one just has to "Enter"/OK to accept it.

How would we differentiate between these potential converts and existing XY users? Just because the former may be used to it, it does not mean that it is in the spirit of what the latter have grown accustom to. I and Don agree on this point: usability is not its strongest point.