How about Total Commander like dual pane view?

Post by **serendipity** » 10 Jan 2008 03:42

OK, this argument cant go on and on. I agree that in some aspects of file management one needs to compare folder and files. For many seems like DP is the ultimate solution and for some like me switching between paths (F7) does the job pretty much the way i want.
DP is not new to this forums and has created one of the most heated debates of all times. OK, lets agree that some of us are hell bent on having DP and threatening to leave forums or stop using XY all together is not the solution. Did any of you even look at this post? Especially page 3:
http://www.xyplorer.com/xyfc/viewtopic. ... torder=asc&

This is a good solution for both DP and non-DP users. It basically means XY remains as it is now and for those who want to compare files the DP style, another instance of XYplorer with list only will be opened and placed next to current running instance of XYplorer.
If I understood correctly Don was nearly convinced by this because it does not interfere with current setup of XY and provides file comparing alternative for DP users.
Surely, having a new instance of XY is not similar to DP, but it does get the job done.
But since this thing is so heated up now, i wonder if Don will be willing to consider even this alternative.

KyferEz · Post by **KyferEz** » 10 Jan 2008 05:21

serendipity wrote:OK, lets agree that some of us are hell bent on having DP and threatening to leave forums or stop using XY all together is not the solution.

Agreed and too late. Furthermore, refusing to code something up because you personally don't like it isn't a good business decision either. I'm exactly the opposite when developing hardware or firmware, or the occasional software - if a feature was asked for and if it can be designed/coded that way, I'll do it.

Post by **admin** » 10 Jan 2008 08:07

The "dual-fools rule" was an insider pun only longer users of the forum could understand.

Jeff Bellune wrote:Suggestion for Don: Maybe the roadmap is a bad idea. Don't tell us what's coming. That way the new features will all be a pleasant surprise, and no one gets too disappointed or angry when their pet feature gets cut.

The purpose of the roadmap is to reduce data traffic in the forum. The message is: I'm aware of that wish, no need to repeat it. Well, in case of DP it did not work...

agnul · Post by **agnul** » 10 Jan 2008 09:55

All this talk about folder compares and no one mentioned winmerge yet? Is that DP enough?

edit: ops, winmerge will not use two panes for comparing folders, but it will compare them all the same

bergfex · Post by **bergfex** » 10 Jan 2008 10:47

agnul wrote:All this talk about folder compares and no one mentioned winmerge yet? Is that DP enough?

Yes, there are numerous tools available, which are all very helpful in comparing files and folders. Others are BeyondCompare, UltraCompare, zsCompare, etc.

Post by **TheQwerty** » 10 Jan 2008 13:20

bergfex wrote:
agnul wrote:All this talk about folder compares and no one mentioned winmerge yet? Is that DP enough?
Yes, there are numerous tools available, which are all very helpful in comparing files and folders. Others are BeyondCompare, UltraCompare, zsCompare, etc.

And this is why I'm a bit confused about all of this DP obsession.

There are numerous tools built with the sole purpose of comparing files and folders. They are a hundred times better suited for this than a file manager is. There's these arguments that the files cannot be compared programmatically, but even if that were true (I don't believe it is) you can compare them in these first and then do the further comparisons and choice-making from there. Why do you have to be using a file manager for this? Plus, some of those comparing tools have plugin APIs so you can extend them to meet whatever your needs really are.

Don could write a fantastic compare tool. He could write a program that rivals all other compare programs. But what would be sacrificed in the file manager? And if he opens that door a little bit will he ever be able to close it or would a flood of more wishes prevent that?

It's the same case with FTP and MP3 tag editing. There are programs dedicated to these types of tasks and they will always do a much better job than a file manager.

I'm starting to wonder if some of these ardent DP fans would also call up CutCo and ask that they make their knives better suited to be used as screwdrivers.

Forty-Two · Post by **Forty-Two** » 10 Jan 2008 13:53

I think you are totally missing the point of comparing files using DP.

How can any of these compare programs mentioned compare the same graphics images in different formats? I use FileLocator Pro, UltraCompare (beware, it's buggy!!) and several programs dedicated to graphics comparison - one which will compare JPEG's of different compressions very quickly.

I have never found anything that will tell me what my eyes can and that is if two images are the same. If necessary I then load them into Creative Suite Premium, or whatever, for final comparison.

I've tried swapping tabs in XY - too much flashing to make it usable. In DP the eyes can flick between the two panes and instantly see matches; then, if necessary, add a filter to show only the images you want.

Post by **TheQwerty** » 10 Jan 2008 14:06

Forty-Two wrote:I think you are totally missing the point of comparing files using DP.

How can any of these compare programs mentioned compare the same graphics images in different formats? I use FileLocator Pro, UltraCompare (beware, it's buggy!!) and several programs dedicated to graphics comparison - one which will compare JPEG's of different compressions very quickly.

I have never found anything that will tell me what my eyes can and that is if two images are the same. If necessary I then load them into Creative Suite Premium, or whatever, for final comparison.

I've tried swapping tabs in XY - too much flashing to make it usable. In DP the eyes can flick between the two panes and instantly see matches; then, if necessary, add a filter to show only the images you want.

Do a search that results in both images and use a thumbnail view. If I can't tell the images are different from that, I use Beyond Compare with the picture viewer plugin, which shows me differences that I wouldn't have even been able to see.

Jeff Bellune · Post by **Jeff Bellune** » 10 Jan 2008 14:50

admin wrote:Well, in case of DP it did not work...

Spectacularly!

Let me just add that DP is not a deal-breaker for me. I'm disappointed, but I like XY enough without DP to keep using it.

The built-in toolbar buttons and menu functions are more extensive and better implemented than any other file manager that I've tried (including DOpus). In fact, I created custom buttons in DOpus just so that I could duplicate some of the built-in button functions in XY!

The Catalog is essential *and* unique in its implementation.

The Info panel is terrific. It's the first thing I miss when using any other file manager.

Mouse-down, blow-up is a great feature. I would like to see better PSD support, but that is a minor annoyance.

Being able to script UDCs, and assign CKSs to them is going to be an essential feature. If/when scripting allows custom toolbar buttons, it will be an incredibly useful feature.

Like I said, I'm disappointed about DP. But stop using XY because of no DP? No way!

-Jeff

infimum · Post by **infimum** » 10 Jan 2008 14:56

Forty-Two wrote:I think you are totally missing the point of comparing files using DP.

How can any of these compare programs mentioned compare the same graphics images in different formats?

What happened to graphics viewer/organizer applications?

Post by **admin** » 10 Jan 2008 14:56

Jeff Bellune wrote:
admin wrote:Well, in case of DP it did not work...
Spectacularly!

Let me just add that DP is not a deal-breaker for me. I'm disappointed, but I like XY enough without DP to keep using it.

The built-in toolbar buttons and menu functions are more extensive and better implemented than any other file manager that I've tried (including DOpus). In fact, I created custom buttons in DOpus just so that I could duplicate some of the built-in button functions in XY!

The Catalog is essential *and* unique in its implementation.

The Info panel is terrific. It's the first thing I miss when using any other file manager.

Mouse-down, blow-up is a great feature. I would like to see better PSD support, but that is a minor annoyance.

Being able to script UDCs, and assign CKSs to them is going to be an essential feature. If/when scripting allows custom toolbar buttons, it will be an incredibly useful feature.

Like I said, I'm disappointed about DP. But stop using XY because of no DP? No way!

I agree with you here.

And lots of good stuff to come...

bergfex · Post by **bergfex** » 10 Jan 2008 16:00

TheQwerty wrote:If I can't tell the images are different from that, I use Beyond Compare with the picture viewer plugin, which shows me differences that I wouldn't have even been able to see.

Thank you for the info, TheQwerty. I use BeyondCompare only sporadically and didn't know that there are plug-ins available. Very useful indeed.

bergfex · Post by **bergfex** » 10 Jan 2008 16:14

Jeff Bellune wrote:But stop using XY because of no DP? No way!

Smart decision.

admin wrote:And lots of good stuff to come...

Yeah, as zridling wrote here:
As if an application could get any better, Donald Lessau’s XYplorer continues to impress us. [...] Lessau is not the one to disappoint… ever!

I think there is nothing to add.

Mesh · Post by **Mesh** » 24 Mar 2008 21:51

I am a new user to XYplorer. I've used many other file managers, and for years had decided on PowerDesk as the best balance between the bunch. As it is effectively a dead product now, I have been looking for a replacement.

After trying many others (including DOpus), I find XYplorer to have the best balance of features and performance - except for dual pane.

This has nothing to do with an outmoded sense of nostalgia, or a resistance to change. It's because, like many others here, there are parts of my workflow that are most efficiently done with a dual pane setup, and multi-tabs just don't cut it. I've read the rest of this thread, and I've seen some of the suggestions offered - but I have to agree with those who state that using a third party app is not only cumbersome, but simply not a substitute in many circumstances.

Speaking as a new user and potential customer, I will state that when it comes to software, in addition to features and performance, support and development are very important to me. From taking an admittedly quick look through the forum, I see that bugs tend to be addressed relatively quickly - which is fantastic. But user requested features don't seem to be handled with the same care and attention. This issue of dual panes seems to be a stellar example of this.

Personally, I don't see what the problem is - given how much this feature is desired and requested by many of XY's users, I don't understand why it hasn't been added as an option. Please note that I'm not talking about changing the nature of XY from one type of file manager to another - but adding it as an option so that users of either philosophy can work as they please.

If we were talking about making XY dual pane *instead* of multi-tab, than I could understand the arguing and resistance by many - the author in particular. But there is no reason why XY can't be both, and as such, I am at a complete loss as to why this feature is getting such resistance.

Some people love having tabs in their internet browsers, and now IE7 supports that. Personally, I hate it - I think it's much more efficient to have a seperate window for each simultaneously open page. But IE 7 allows people of either philosophy to work exactly the way they want to. There's no reason why XY can't do the same.

Having said all that, I am thrilled to see the features and polish that XY possesses. However, I am going to decline making a purchase at this time. The first reason is that I require dual pane, and XY doesn't have it. But the second reason is that as a prospective customer, the arguing and resistance that the author has exhibited towards implementing a feature that is clearly desired by many users and potential customers makes me nervous.

The best developers I have had relationships with respond to feature requests with a positive attitude. It's not about whether they themselves have any use for the feature in question - if the users have a genuine desire and use for it, they do their best to implement it.

What I'm seeing here worries me, and that gives me pause. If these things should change, and dual pane is implemented well into XY (and I do mean well, as opposed to a half-hearted attempt to stop the begging), I will reconsider and most likely make a purchase at that time. But until then, I'm afraid I have to look elsewhere.

graham · Post by **graham** » 24 Mar 2008 22:42

mesh wrote:

The best developers I have had relationships with respond to feature requests with a positive attitude. It's not about whether they themselves have any use for the feature in question - if the users have a genuine desire and use for it, they do their best to implement it.

What I'm seeing here worries me, and that gives me pause. If these things should change, dual pane is implemented well into XY (and I do mean well, as opposed to a half-hearted attempt to stop the begging), I will reconsider and most likely make a purchase at that time. But until then, I'm afraid I have to look elsewhere.

Hi,
Whilst there are many who have wished for DP there are many who manage quite happily without it. I think Don is driving XYPlorer in a direction which offers many new innovative ideas in file management which will more than compensate. The introduction of scripting is just the start and in a years time this feature alone will provide expert users facilities othe FM's can only dream about. Yes, you are right, the lack of DP will lose some sales but that is the name of the game. XYPlorer is Don's product and there for evaluation, he alone determines the future and consquences, with input from users. The rate of change, bug free code and attention to detail make XYPlorer, for me, in a league of it's own. If, however, you need DP above all else then as you have said it is your choice. May I suggest you keep looking at this forum as the day will come when DP will not be so high on your need list.