License/number of computers question

Post by **j_c_hallgren** » 25 Jan 2007 16:02

I'd suggest these minor verbiage tweaks...and also maybe try this format:
"Number of licenses: 2" means either:
Individual License : 2 specific persons may use XYplorer on any computer or computers
Site License : XYplorer may be used on 2 computers within a specific organization by any person or persons

Regarding forum, in that case, maybe say "Guaranteed support via online user forum and/or email"? That would mean you'd always make sure they'd get an answer, but if we handled it first, you'd not be required to.

About the "lifetime" thing: I've seen it listed before with a disclaimer such as "Lifetime means while product is still offered for sale"

jacky · Post by **jacky** » 26 Jan 2007 02:42

admin wrote:License Types
There are two types of licensing concepts for XYplorer. You can decide freely which one is more suitable for you. The prices are identical, and both are lifetime licenses and include all future updates.

1. The Individual License
Entitles one specific person to install and run XYplorer on one or more computers. Just like the application itself, the license is portable and the owner can use it anywhere he likes.

2. The Site License
Entitles one specific organization to install and run XYplorer on the specified number of computers. "Lifetime" in this case means lifetime of the organization.

Example
"Number of licenses: 2" means either "2 specific persons may use XYplorer on any computer" (= 2 Individual Licenses), or "XYplorer may be used on 2 computers within a specific organization by any person" (= Site License for 2 computers). Your choice!

What do you think about it (and the English)? Clear enough?

Yep, sounds better/clearer to me

Allthough I have a question. In your example you talk about what "Number of licenses: 2" means, and you say it's up to us to choose which types we want. But does that mean one could change its type of license with time?

As in, one buys a license and use it as an individual license, so he got XY on his own PC, at his work, and on some other PC he (and only he) has to work on sometimes.
Later on, things changes for him and he now only ever uses only one computer. But he's not alone to use it (and use XY), they are 3 of them total. Would it be ok to go on without buying a new license, because it would now be a Site license?

Because it kinda sounds like so a bit, and if that's the case maybe not refer to it as two different kinds of license, but one single license concept that allows either the use of XY by as many specific persons as licenses were bought on one or more computers; or the use of XY by one or more persons on as many computers as licenses were bought.

Post by **admin** » 26 Jan 2007 18:31

jacky wrote:... Because it kinda sounds like so a bit, and if that's the case maybe not refer to it as two different kinds of license, but one single license concept that allows either the use of XY by as many specific persons as licenses were bought on one or more computers; or the use of XY by one or more persons on as many computers as licenses were bought.

Yes, exactly! The license adapts to your long-term needs. A flex-license. So how should I call it? Two "interpretations of ownership"?

I see that there's a potential margin of abuse built-in when you change the definition just as it suits you from day-to-day. But I'm confident that most of my paying users do not cheat but stick to the fundamental rules of business just as they expect me to deliver a reliable software.

jacky · Post by **jacky** » 26 Jan 2007 22:38

admin wrote:Yes, exactly! The license adapts to your long-term needs. A flex-license. So how should I call it? Two "interpretations of ownership"?

Well, then I'd really say not to talk about two different licenses, but only one XY license that, as you said, adapts to one's long-term needs.

I was thinking about how to explain all this best, but I think there's something that can be a bit confusing : One can buy one lifetime license, that "contains" (is valid for) a defined number of licenses. Maybe there should be another term used there. So no matter what, one always buys one single license for XY. (and that'd be the only time the term "license" would be used)

Each license is valid/allows for a defined number "simultaneous use". I couldn't really find one (better) word that would sums it up for both case...

Or maybe "volume"...

XYplorer comes with a lifetime license which includes all future updates for free! The XYplorer license is flexible and adapts to your needs.

It comes with two different applications:
- People-based. The volume of the license is the number of person allowed to use this XY license. Each of them is allowed to use it on as many computers as they might need. Yes, XYplorer is a portable application, and so is its license : you can bring it on with you wherever you go!
- Site-based. The volume of the license is then the number of computers XY can be installed on within a specific organization. Each of those copies can be used by as many people as needed, no limit.

When you buy a license, you can choose for which "volume" it will be valid for.
You can then freely choose whether you want to use its People-based or its Site-based application. Obviously, only one application can be valid at one time, and the volume is fixed. But you can freely decide and change which application is valid during the whole time of the license.

Example: A license for a volume of 2 allows :
- People-based: Only 2 persons can use XYplorer, on as many computers as they want.
- Site-based: XYplorer can be installed on only 2 computers. Each copies can be used by as many persons as needed.

Post by **j_c_hallgren** » 26 Jan 2007 23:48

I've made some changes to jacky's text and think this is a bit more readable and "legal" sounding. My changes are mostly in italics.

jacky wrote:It is available in two different plans:
(1) - People-based. The limit of the license is the number of people allowed to use this XY license. Each of them is allowed to use it on as many computers as they might need. Yes, XYplorer is a portable application, and so is the license. You take it with you wherever you go!
(2) - Site-based. The limit of the license is then the number of computers XY can be installed on within a specific organization. Each of those copies can be used by as many people as needed, but can only be installed or used on other computers if the previous installation is removed.

You choose the "limit" by purchasing that number of licenses.
You can then freely choose whether you want a People-based or Site-based plan. Obviously, only one plan can be valid at one time, and the limit is fixed. But you can freely decide and change which plan is valid, as long as the usage limit is not exceeded.

Example: A license with a limit of 2 allows :
- People-based: Only 2 people can use XYplorer, on as many computers as they want.
- Site-based: XYplorer can be installed on only 2 computers. Each copy can be used by as many people as needed.

CitizenD · Post by **CitizenD** » 27 Jan 2007 11:55

If the license can be changed, at any time, by any registered user then you should probably remove the word "organization" from the site based license and talk purely in terms of people and installations.

Another angle to consider is server/network share based installations. A company or group could buy one site license, install XYPlorer on a network share or server and have anyone else on the network run it from the share. As XYPlorer is designed to be portable this would be very easy to do and technically it would be under the current license terms for a single site-based installation license.

Cheers,

D

Post by **admin** » 27 Jan 2007 15:07

Thank you all for your ideas and definitions! I personally think XY's license policy, as I envisioned it, comes out quite clearly now.

However, I also think newbie's first impression will surely be: "Hmm, this is complex stuff!" before he dives into it and understands that it really is good stuff! I really don't want to drive anybody away by lawyer garble.

So I'm thinking about making it a much simpler while keeping the main ideas alive. What about this:

"Generally, the XYplorer license entitles a person or organization to install and run XYplorer on the specified number of computers. However, if one person owns and uses more than one computer (say a desktop machine and a laptop) then one license does cover it."

EDIT, okay, there's an ambiguous/unclear usage of the term "license" here. Let's try it this way:

"Generally, XYplorer licenses are computer-based: one license entitles a person or organization to install and run XYplorer on one computer. However, if a person owns and uses more than one computer (say a desktop machine and a laptop) then one license does cover it."

@CitizenD: I think the phrase "install and run" should eliminate the multiple use of share based installations because they are *run* from different terminals, right?

jacky · Post by **jacky** » 27 Jan 2007 18:44

admin wrote:"Generally, XYplorer licenses are computer-based: one license entitles a person or organization to install and run XYplorer on one computer. However, if a person owns and uses more than one computer (say a desktop machine and a laptop) then one license does cover it."

hmm.. that means if one does own only one computer, and uses another at work, one license doesn't cover it (since he doen't own that computer), or?

This formulation also says that licenses are computer-based, with a special exeption for one person that owns&uses more computer. So no more one license works for all people of one organization using XY on the same computer?

Post by **admin** » 27 Jan 2007 22:12

jacky wrote:
admin wrote:"Generally, XYplorer licenses are computer-based: one license entitles a person or organization to install and run XYplorer on one computer. However, if a person owns and uses more than one computer (say a desktop machine and a laptop) then one license does cover it."
hmm.. that means if one does own only one computer, and uses another at work, one license doesn't cover it (since he doen't own that computer), or?

That's true. The one at work should be paid by your boss. This is very common and common sense licensing practice.

jacky wrote:This formulation also says that licenses are computer-based, with a special exeption for one person that owns&uses more computer. So no more one license works for all people of one organization using XY on the same computer?

No, why? The normal general fundamental basic rule is: 1 License for each computer on which XY is used. People are not counted. If your company has 1 computer for 10 people, 1 license is enough!
The exception is: if you own more than 1 computer and you use them exclusively (no other people use them), then it counts as 1 computer, like a big extended distributed multipart machine. This exception exists only to cover XY's portability within the price of one license. Because I cannot say "The portable file manager (but you need to buy at least 2 licenses to carry it around legally)".

CitizenD · Post by **CitizenD** » 27 Jan 2007 23:36

I'm glad you have decided to simplify it. I can understand where you are coming from in how you would like the license to work, and either way there is room for abuse if users so choose, so simplifying the wording is great.

That last bit sums it up nicely, and yes the install and run should cover the network share bit I reckon.

The only tiny thing I'd change is add the word "exclusively" before the first left bracket in your description. Makes it clear that you are telling them they can use it on other PC's and USB sticks etc., but only if it is for their exclusive use and if more people use that device then another license is required.

Cheers,

D

Post by **admin** » 28 Jan 2007 05:31

CitizenD wrote:The only tiny thing I'd change is add the word "exclusively" before the first left bracket in your description. Makes it clear that you are telling them they can use it on other PC's and USB sticks etc., but only if it is for their exclusive use and if more people use that device then another license is required.

Good, thanks! So, here we go (finally?):

"Generally, XYplorer licenses are computer-based: one license entitles a person or organization to install and run XYplorer on one computer. However, if a person owns and uses more than one computer exclusively (say a desktop machine and a laptop) then one license does cover it."

Post by **j_c_hallgren** » 28 Jan 2007 06:15

I certainly don't want to be a party-pooper here...but these last variations have, IMO, a few holes that need to be filled...sorry!

1) You say a "person or organization"...ok, so how does that handle a husband/wife or similar who jointly own the computer(s)? They are neither, since they are people, not just a person...and they are not an organization.

2) "owns and uses more than one computer exclusively" : How about family again, where Dad owns the desktop and laptop, and he is the only one to use both, thus he is exclusive in that respect, but his son uses the desktop only...so exclusive isn't quite tied to exclusive use of XY.

3) "However, if a person owns" : What about when a company (with a sole owner and no employees) technically on paper owns more than one system? Humm?? Does the "company" get to use it on desktop and laptop? Since only one person will be using it, but he/she doesn't own it, as the business name owns it.

The goal is, as I tried in my attempt previously, to make it simple enough to follow, yet tight enough to eliminate any vagueness...I thought my version did a reasonable job of both...some people have thought I should have been a lawyer, not a programmer, as I can be very picky at times!

Another goal is: Prevent more than one copy from being used by more than one person at a time, right? That's why I used 'limit' in my attempt.
I don't see that as being fully described as such in last variant...

This is why EULA's tend to be SOOOOOOOOOOO long and full of tiny print!

CitizenD · Post by **CitizenD** » 28 Jan 2007 08:43

1) You say a "person or organization"...ok, so how does that handle a husband/wife or similar who jointly own the computer(s)? They are neither, since they are people, not just a person...and they are not an organization.

What does their marital status have to do with the license? If the license is computer based then they can both use it on the one computer.

2) "owns and uses more than one computer exclusively" : How about family again, where Dad owns the desktop and laptop, and he is the only one to use both, thus he is exclusive in that respect, but his son uses the desktop only...so exclusive isn't quite tied to exclusive use of XY.

Then two licenses are needed - one for the Dad, and one for the son.

3) "However, if a person owns" : What about when a company (with a sole owner and no employees) technically on paper owns more than one system? Humm?? Does the "company" get to use it on desktop and laptop? Since only one person will be using it, but he/she doesn't own it, as the business name owns it.

If there are one owner and no employees then the owner can use it on all systems on one license. As soon as another employee begins using one or more systems then they will need to purchase another license.

Perhaps the "owns" should be removed and simply "uses" left in.

The previous license, where it could magically "change" from people to site based was confusing and unnecessary, and I daresay legally as watertight as a submarine with screen doors.

Cheers,

D

Post by **admin** » 28 Jan 2007 09:55

Before we meet in court, here's another version(s). Get the spirit beneath the words!

Short version that you will find on homepage and in help file:
"Generally, XYplorer licenses are computer-based: One license entitles a person or organization to install and run XYplorer on one computer. Exception: If a person uses more than one computer exclusively (say a desktop machine and a laptop) then one license does cover it."

Extended version that you will find in the XYPLORER LICENSE AGREEMENT (LicenseXY.txt):
LICENSE GRANT. On purchase you are granted a non-exclusive and non-transferable right to use XYplorer as indicated herein: Each license covers the right to install and run XYplorer on one single computer or workstation. However, if a person uses more than one computer exclusively (say a desktop machine and a laptop) then one license does cover it. Floating or concurrent license usage is expressly prohibited. XYplorer licenses are valid for lifetime and include all available future updates of the Software.

jacky · Post by **jacky** » 28 Jan 2007 17:40

admin wrote:
jacky wrote:hmm.. that means if one does own only one computer, and uses another at work, one license doesn't cover it (since he doen't own that computer), or?
That's true. The one at work should be paid by your boss. This is very common and common sense licensing practice.

hmm.. ok so just to be a PITA one more time, regarding the portability factor. Your new license term tend to say one cannot use XY on a computers friend or at work. So portability is limited to the computers one owns & uses exclusively?