Here's the new BETA (32-bit)

[j_c_hallgren]

Ok, I'll concede..."Calculate Folder sizes" works for me as second choice...it's definitely better than original text..Thanks!!!

Notes to Admin/Don for the "whenever I'm bored and have a chance" list: 1) Add that string to the HELP file (and index) with a desc of what it does.
Also update the Keyboard shortcuts with revised text.
Which implies...another "fix" --> moving the desc of "F4" and "F5" from the Edit menu to View menu in the help file.
2) Remove "(menu Go)" from "Clear history on exit" because: Now that history is available via down-arrows, the Go menu ref is incorrect. And I think anyone would understand what history is and isn't...if not, clarify in Help file.

[JoDeCologne]

I believe the choices as I proposed would be clear and understandable by most all users, including newbies/dummies...

Could some other all users, including newbies/dummies, comment, please. It's always good to hear a 2nd opinion.
My own suggestion still stands (while the wording can surely be improved):

Code: Select all

Auto-refresh on file system changes 
  Include network locations

I like your solution best - it's easy to understand and, as far as I understand, technically sufficient.

[admin]

Note: I have very little time at the moment. All your posts are read and will be answered, but a bit slower than usual...

Download the latest XYplorer BETA version (v4.40.0038, 10-jan-2006).

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v4.40.0038 - 10.01.06 09:35
    ! Toolbar, history buttons: fixed a number of glitches.
    * Toolbar, history buttons: now the arrow-dropdown-menus align to 
      the bottom left of the toolbar buttons, and with a second click on 
      the button you can close them.
    * Toolbar, history buttons, arrow-dropdown-menus: now the "back" 
      menu just shows previous history items, and the "fore" menu just 
      next history items. Just as you know it from other apps.
      The right-click context menu shows all history items.
    * Menu View: renamed "Show Folder Sizes for Now" to "Calculate 
      Folder Sizes".
    * Configuration/General: renamed "Forget history" to "Clear history 
      on exit".
    - Menu Go: removed "experimental new history feature" from 
      v3.60.0024 ("only if you stay at least 2 seconds in a location it 
      will be permanently stored in the history").
      Now every browsed location is uncondintionally added to the 
      history.

[admin]

"Clear History on Exit"

Yep, that's it!

Some users may prefer only a few entries, so as maybe, to not obscure view of tree while showing, or for some other unexplained reason.

Naah, a touch too much "configurability" for my taste.

[admin]

I'd go for something like "Calculate folder sizes", I think it means will do it now, wont stay, etc...

Hey, I came out of the shower this morning with exactly this idea! Maybe Shift+F5 is not optimal, because F5 implies Refresh, but I won't change it, it's in long enough to merit persistence.

BTW it seems sometimes XY "forgets" a location, like if I use a favorite to go to R:\ and then quickly go to R:\Folder I will not have R:\ is the history. Don't know if it's something done on purpose or not, but it can be quite annoying/confusing at times, cause you hit back and aren't where you were before, but where you were before that. And it's not always just a parent folder like in my example, can be a completely different location

Yes, it's on purpose! I added (20040903) a little time delay check to avoid that locations are added to the list, where you are only so short a time (hardcoded to < 2 sec) that it can not be considered "being there". It bugged me ever since!! Since it's not documented anyway, and with your kind permission, I just take it out again! It's just one of those "smart" features nobody needs...

[CyGho]

Could some other all users, including newbies/dummies, comment, please.[/b] It's always good to hear a 2nd opinion.
My own suggestion still stands (while the wording can surely be improved):

Code: Select all

Auto-refresh on file system changes 
  Include network locations

For me it's only important to exclude (wireless) network locations and i mean mapped drives by that. XYplorer is totaly useless if i include wireles mapped drives. Well even if they are exlude it's way to slow on long listings but i need some functions XYplorer has witch Explorer has not.

[j_c_hallgren]

I for one wouldn't like the "refresh" idea either, since it implies that it's something XY usually do, and you'll just refreh it. I'd go for something like "Calculate folder sizes", I think it means will do it now, wont stay, etc

Given that the term/phrase used to describe the display of folder sizes is "Show" (via the Shift), and that a refresh is implied (via the F5), and that we need to define that it is NOT a toggle (which the text w/o "for now" did, to me), but a one-time thing, that's why I combined the two.

Thus stating that you want a F5 refresh, but adding the 'Shift' Show folder size to it, so maybe "Refresh + Show Folder Sizes" or "Refresh & Show Folder Sizes"?
Remember, what we're trying to provide is only a clear hint of what action to do...the docs would spell out in a bit more detail exactly what is going on.

[jacky]

So making it clearer is definitely good idea...though, I might have used the text "Refresh showing folder sizes", which clarifies that it does a refresh plus showing size, which the other text does not. And the "for now" makes me think/ask: how long is now? Just once, or until I do it again?

hmm.. I agree I'm not sure the "for now" sounds so good. I for one wouldn't like the "refresh" idea either, since it implies that it's something XY usually do, and you'll just refreh it. I'd go for something like "Calculate folder sizes", I think it means will do it now, wont stay, etc

Of course, I'm still not sure what "forget history" does, as I set it on and my history is still there..

I think it means it wont be remembered yes. To clear it now you have to click on Go/Clear history

BTW it seems sometimes XY "forgets" a location, like if I use a favorite to go to R:\ and then quickly go to R:\Folder I will not have R:\ is the history. Don't know if it's something done on purpose or not, but it can be quite annoying/confusing at times, cause you hit back and aren't where you were before, but where you were before that. And it's not always just a parent folder like in my example, can be a completely different location

[j_c_hallgren]

I'll admit, I was confused by the meaning/function of the Shift+F5 combo.
It appeared to me that it was a toggle of the "Show" option, when it wasn't.

So making it clearer is definitely good idea...though, I might have used the text "Refresh showing folder sizes", which clarifies that it does a refresh plus showing size, which the other text does not. And the "for now" makes me think/ask: how long is now? Just once, or until I do it again?
By using the "Refresh" word, that to me states that it's a one-time deal.

I think that, plus a brief blurb in help/docs, would make it 110% clear.

-----------
Topic #2: Additional entries saved in history: GOOD IDEA!
But...alternate suggestion: Allow USER to select nbr of entries saved (within limits 0-32) in place of existing "Forget history" option on Config.

This would be the more typical option I've seen in some other pgms.
Use "Nbr of History entries to save" maybe?
Of course, I'm still not sure what "forget history" does, as I set it on and my history is still there..at least while I'm still in pgm...or is it to forget on exit only? If so, "Clear History on Exit" would be better text in that case.

Some users may prefer only a few entries, so as maybe, to not obscure view of tree while showing, or for some other unexplained reason.

[admin]

On a slower system with large heavily populated HD, it may be desireable to NOT update everything else, just the current folder...give user the choice!

With non-current folders it's really not a matter of performance since I update no data but just some tree captions. And polling the information isn't expensive either (unless on some networks). Also no floppies are ever accessed here.

I believe the choices as I proposed would be clear and understandable by most all users, including newbies/dummies...

Could some other all users, including newbies/dummies, comment, please. It's always good to hear a 2nd opinion.
My own suggestion still stands (while the wording can surely be improved):

Code: Select all

Auto-refresh on file system changes 
  Include network locations

[admin]

Note: I have very little time at the moment. All your posts are read and will be answered, but a bit slower than usual...

Download the latest XYplorer BETA version (v4.40.0036, 09-jan-2006).

Code: Select all

v4.40.0036 - 09.01.06 13:49
    + Toolbar: added a bit of visual 3D push effect.
    + Toolbar, history buttons (back/fore): added drop down arrows. Now 
      you can popup the context menu also with a left click, or with a 
      still cooler mousedown-and-select-on-mouseup motion. Right click 
      still works as well.
    * Toolbar, history buttons, context menu: now shows only the history 
      items, not the other stuff from menu Go.
    * Toolbar, history buttons, context menu: increased maximum menu 
      size from 24 to 32 items.
    * Menu View: renamed "Show Folder Sizes" to "Show Folder Sizes for 
      Now" to make clear that this is just a one time command, not a 
      setting. To show folder sizes always you have to set it in 
      Configuration/General.
    ! Menu File, Info to Clipboard: there were some minor 
      inconsistencies when copying current/selected path/files (Ctrl+P) or 
      current/selected paths (Ctrl+Shift+P) from tree and list. Fixed.
      Ctrl+P:
        if list has focus and items are selected then
          copy all selected items' names with full path to clipboard
        else
          copy current tree path to clipboard
      Ctrl+Shift+P:
        if list has focus and items are selected then
          copy all selected items' full path to clipboard
        else
          copy current tree path to clipboard

[j_c_hallgren]

I don't have much time at this moment, but...
I still think giving choices as I suggested would be good..because:

On a slower system with large heavily populated HD, it may be desireable to NOT update everything else, just the current folder...give user the choice!
And I may want to exclude the removeable drive as it may be a floppy and prefer not to access it more than absolutely needed...ok?

I believe the choices as I proposed would be clear and understandable by most all users, including newbies/dummies...

[admin]

Because IF you want update of current selected, it shouldn't matter WHERE it is...but if you want the 'rest of the world' updated, you may want to limit it to 1 or 2 of the 3 choices....

Sounds reasonable, but I should tell (or have told) you something about the history of this option: Not long ago, there was just one "Auto-Refresh..." checkbox. Then I got a hint that network access slowed down with "Auto-Refresh..." on. I could not reproduce this on my little home network though, so to find out experimentally what was happening on the users' networks I offered these increased configuration options.

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v4.40.0000 - 26.11.05 19:15
    + Configuration: redesigned the "Auto-refresh on file system changes" 
      section. Now you can specify in a very detailed way what you want 
      to be watched and where.
      For your interest as a programmer:
      - "Watch current path and subtree on: Local drives/Network drives" 
        uses the FindFirstChangeNotification API.
      - "Watch non-current locations: Folders/Removable drives" uses the 
        SHChangeNotify API.
      Tip: if you are using the network a lot you might encounter 
      dramatic speed differences related to these settings.
        Note that auto-refresh concerns exclusively changes triggered 
      from other processes. If you disable it completely, XYplorer 
      should still correctly update the display with regard to its own 
      file operations. I say should... some things might have slipt 
      through...

Result: the "Network Drives" checkbox made all the difference.

So, I would think it would be enough to have just 2 checkboxes now, one being a sub-option of the other:

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Auto-refresh on file system changes
  Include network locations

BTW, performance losses are not notable here.

[j_c_hallgren]

Before I make a suggestion on changes to text, I'd need to fully 100% understand what the sub-options do, and the way they are now, it's a bit hard to see that...so my comments are based on how it appears to be.

The first thing I would do is add a ":" to end of "...system changes" line to clarify futher that following are sub-options. The indent does somewhat, but that would nail it down.

Anyway, here's how I could see it (but maybe this doesn't match current code):
----------------------

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Auto-refresh on file system changes:
    Current path/folder only
    All paths/folders:
        On local drives
        On network drives
        On removable drives

if Current not selected, ALL is default (or could be mutually exclusive checkbox), which would then allow the device type to be specified via the next three

---------------------------------
Because IF you want update of current selected, it shouldn't matter WHERE it is...but if you want the 'rest of the world' updated, you may want to limit it to 1 or 2 of the 3 choices....

[admin]

As a newbie, i can see the value in the option...so maybe it's just how it's labeled and/or documented that is the problem...

Ok, you have a suggestion for improval? (I liked your other ideas conc. Report tab, will eventually realize them...)