Tags are missing when backing up files. How to solve?

[cadu]

Hi,

I use the software SyncBackPro to make backups from computer HD to external drive and to internet storage.

I realized the files backed up are without all tags I had applied. It seems the backup copies the files and I read in help file that tags aren't copied=> From XY help "Copying items, the tags will not be copied along with the items, in an effort to keep your database tidy and avoid multiplying tags which could eventually slow things down. Any previously existing items will keep their original tags".

Is there any configuration that could be made to transfer the tag together the file? How could I maintain the tags in this backup situation?

I am afraid once I am spending a plenty of time tagging and it will exist just in my computer. If I need to recover a backup or even copy a file to HD (to work home and then copy and paste in work computer again), these operations will make all tags disappear...

Thanks in advance!!!

[Twisten]

Thats a puzzler since the tags in XYplorer aren't part of the file but are kept in a separate database.
Perhaps an option to export/import tags for files in current directory or current and down (to subfolders of current).
In any case you'll have to do it yourself or by script (or perhaps XYplorer's backup function) since you can't expect third party software to be aware of it.

[cadu]

I am new on XY and it is seeming complex...

My main concern is with backup. Even using XY built-in "backup to" the tags aren't maintained together the file backed up.

Considering my computer crashes and I need format it, how could a recovery thousands of tags, labels and comments, once the backup files are without tag information?

Actually, I am beginning to be without confidence in relation to handle tags using XY... A despite of limitations, the default file metadata seems to be safer and handier.

[admin]

You backup your tags by backing up tag.dat.

[cadu]

The question is not just the tag backup, but the files backup that are being storage without tags.

I have an external drive in which my files are being storage without tag (because when copying, the tags aren't attached to files even when using XY "backup to").

Consider my computer crashed and I need to put it in order again. When I restore my backup all files will be without tag. So, is there any handy way to attache the tags storage in tag.dat to the files without tags?

[admin]

The question is not just the tag backup, but the files backup that are being storage without tags.

I have an external drive in which my files are being storage without tag (because when copying, the tags aren't attached to files even when using XY "backup to").

Consider my computer crashed and I need to put it in order again. When I restore my backup all files will be without tag. So, is there any handy way to attache the tags storage in tag.dat to the files without tags?

Depends what you find handy. If you backup tag.dat on the same medium as your files you have all the data together, even in a human readable way (tag.dat is an open format text file) so for each file you know exactly not only the tag information but also the location. I find this handy and safe.

>Consider my computer crashed ...
For this scenario I can only recommend making an image of your harddrive, or better three images, and deposit them in different geographical locations. Everything else is half-baked nonsense. Repeat this at least once a month.

[cadu]

I took a look in tag.dat and realized the simple structure indeed. I would appreciate further help to deal better with tag storage:

My backup is storage in an external drive (E:), so in other medium than the current tagged files (C:).

a) Considering all my data in C: were erased (formatted) and I will restore my backup maintaining the same folder structure. Should the tags be attached to the files in (C:) that came from (E:) automatically?

b) I tagged files in an external drive (E:). Then, in other computer the drive changed automatically to (H:). It seems XY doesn't re-index the tags and it should be manually, isn't it? I had to try re-index manually. I edited tag.dat in order to change just the drive (from E to H). But the new drive letter (maintaining the same folder structure) doesn't show the tags (I was expecting it will once I just change from E:\Beach_1.jpg|0|trial|||| to H:\Beach_1.jpg|0|trial||||). It seems that XYplorer has a problem with sorting of tag.dat. For instance (the tag pattern it is just illustrative) in this case tag3 isn't read in my XYplorer:

E:\tag1
F:\tag2
E:\tag3

But if I change to:
E:\tag1
E:\tag3
F:\tag2
the tags will be read.

The problem is that E:\tag3 was H:\tag3 and I had to edit "by hand" from H: to E:. So, besides editing, sorting tag.dat was need (at least in my XYplorer tag.dat).

Considering thousands of tags, it seems to me very difficult to deal with (and to a mouse-icon-user it sounds almost impossible). Any suggestion to handle this situation in a better way?

c) Editing tag manually could bring some mess to tag.dat. For instance, a same external drive that had files tagged when was showed as different driver id (e.g. E: or F:) will have tags attached to both drives. To get more mess, it seems XYplorer sort external drivers tags by tagging order (just c: is maintained sorted in my tag.dat file). Considering I use 3 external drives that will assume different id I won't know how to begin re-indexing tags "by hand" when needed.

Overall view=> it seems just to drive C: it is reasonable deal with tag.dat storage. To external drives it is potentially hard. The bigger number of drivers and tags you have, the bigger will be the mess to re-index tag.dat "by hand".

Ps.: I was thinking that the XY command "reload tags database" would be a kind of automatic re-index way to deal with the issues pointed above (but unfortunately it seems not be related to this). I use "Sony Media Manager (Vegas Plugin)" to deal with video/audio tagging and this software provides a "smart search" in which a driver that had its id changed is fast searched and the tags are re-indexed automatically. If the re-index in XY just work "by hand" (I am not sure) a kind of "smart search" would be a great improvement to hard-work-tagging users!

[cadu]

I made some tests assigning a permanent drive letter to external drive. In this way XYplorer could maintain the index of tags through different computers sessions (since the different HDs will have the same letter). It is important to choose a letter that has less chance to be used by computers (e.g. M, N, O). Then post-it the HD to remember the letter to be assigning always! Otherwise to deal with this issue will become a mess as I related in former post.

Here the steps to assigning a permanent drive letter to external drive:

http://geekswithblogs.net/WynApseTechni ... 13922.aspx

[admin]

Let me give a short general answer:

XYplorer is a file manager that attempts to make your computer life easier by providing lots of configurable automation options. The configuration file formats are open and human-friendly, and everything is fully portable.

XYplorer is not a backup/restore solution that brings you quickly back to business after your computer crashed. This is a totally different branch of software.

But given the openness of XYplorer's format and its portability you CAN restore everything in case of emergency (which in reality does not happen that often but maybe once in 3 to 5 years) but it takes manual work and a little thinking. Which is a good deal if it restores your work of the last 3 to 5 years.

[Filehero]

.... and a little thinking.

Which, btw, is a necessity for every backup plan, no matter what kind of tool is used.


Cheers,
Filehero

[highend]

Wich, btw, is a necessity for every backup plan, no matter what kind of tool is used.

rsync!

Damn, I had to think about the spelling

[cadu]

XY solve a plenty of file management issues I had. Amazing tool and I really like it. I tried a plenty of others file managers and XY is the best in my opinion

Although "backup" seems to be the center of the issue, it isn't. I am not approaching XY backup features, but the tags.

Behind it are the issues:

a) XY doesn't copy the tags together the files.

b) XY doesn't provide ways of re-index tags through friendly interface or automatically (and to re-index by hand thousands of tags in several drivers isn't handy IMHO).

My issue seems to be related to this others as well:
http://www.xyplorer.com/xyfc/viewtopic. ... t=tag+copy
http://www.xyplorer.com/xyfc/viewtopic. ... tags+bound

If (a) was provided as an configuration feature (if the user set XY would copy the tags together), I think 70% of the problems I mentioned would be solved. If a friendly way of re-index tag was provided (b) the other 30% would be solved.

I don't master XY (yet!) but could some script provide any solution related to (a) or (b)?

[admin]

a) XY doesn't copy the tags together the files.

b) XY doesn't provide ways of re-index tags through friendly interface or automatically (and to re-index by hand thousands of tags in several drivers isn't handy IMHO).

a) Yes, that's the architecture here. Like every fundamental decision it has pros and cons.

b) No, but a global change (e.g. Replace all "C:\Work" with "D:\Work\New\") in tag.dat over thousands of tags takes you some seconds. Where's the problem?
And apart from that, I don't see your nightmare situation coming. If you move files, the tags are moved along fully automatic. If you Backup/Restore files, there is no need to update tag.dat. So again: Where's the problem?

[cadu]

b) No, but a global change (e.g. Replace all "C:\Work" with "D:\Work\New\") in tag.dat over thousands of tags takes you some seconds. Where's the problem?
And apart from that, I don't see your nightmare situation coming. If you move files, the tags are moved along fully automatic. If you Backup/Restore files, there is no need to update tag.dat. So again: Where's the problem?

About C: any problem. But dealing with tag.dat and several external drivers that will change driver letter often wasn't handy. I experienced it (I don't know if it happens just with me, but besides exchange driver latter in tag.dat it is necessary sort the data to driver be recognized - I mean if one have E:tag1 / F: tag2 / E:tag3, this latter won't be recognized and it could be H:tag3 that was changed to E: and will be out of order/sort). Anyway, as I mentioned before, since it is assigned a permanent drive letter to external drive (http://geekswithblogs.net/WynApseTechni ... 13922.aspx) it will be simpler to deal with XY tag.dat indexing of external drives (I made this and all the problems I related before were solved).

As you told "that's the architecture here. Like every fundamental decision it has pros and cons". Anyway, even with tag indexing "cons", there are alternative ways to manage/handle it through XYplorer as I could experimented