Dual Pane - Formal Proposal Thread

[vlad1966]

Personally, I could care less about "dual pane".
What I'd like is "Column view" like OS X Finder & KDE's Dolphin has.
Why settle for viewing 2 levels of storage when you can view as many as can fit on your screen?

XYPlorer's tree view is no better than Microsoft's File Browser. The only thing that got me to use XYPlorer are the Tabs, which still isn't as good as Column View in Dolphin or OS X.

Dolphin: http://enzosworld.gmxhome.de/images/view_mode_5.png

OS X Finder: http://patterns.holehan.org/uploads/osx ... gories.png

[Mesh]

Personally, I could care less about "dual pane".
What I'd like is "Column view" like OS X Finder & KDE's Dolphin has.
Why settle for viewing 2 levels of storage when you can view as many as can fit on your screen?

Well, you're in the wrong thread, then.

[admin]

Mesh,

help me stop my wondering: Why do you go into this labour of working out a Dual Pane Proposal for XY instead of using one of the numerous DP file managers that already exist?

Don

[Mesh]

Mesh,

help me stop my wondering: Why do you go into this labour of working out a Dual Pane Proposal for XY instead of using one of the numerous DP file managers that already exist?

Don

For years, I used PowerDesk. It was basic, but it served my needs. It finally reached the point earlier this year, where the bugs and lack of development and support tipped the balance and I decided it was time to find a new file manager.

I researched what's out there at the moment, and I looked into or evaluated most of the promising ones that appeared to have the features I wanted and needed (which included dual pane support). They all failed to meet my standards and requirements. The two most promising ones on my initial list were Directory Opus and Xplorer2.

Directory Opus had a lot of features, but they were not well implemented. Actions and behaviors that should have been intuitive, set by default, or easy to access instead took many people hours to find and use. And one of the dealbreakers for me was how it was set to run - unlike most other file managers, Directory Opus was not used as a standalone app. It was designed to always run in the background - this, to me, was a poor choice for the developers to make, and I was unwilling to use a file manager designed that way.

Xplorer2 seemed to be where I was heading - until I looked into it more closely. While it had an ambitious set of features, it was not well coded. There were a lot of bugs that should not have been there, and it lacked the polish of a well cared for application. When I came across a bit of information that the developer had lost interest in it as a project, this made sense to me. Clearly, it didn't make the cut - and it appeared to be set up to go the same route as Powerdesk.


So, I went back and looked at the second tier of my list - apps that looked promising, but didn't have the full set of features I was looking for. XY was on this list, and I'm extremely thankful that circumstances led me to evaluate it.

With the sole exception of dual pane, it had everything I wanted in a file manager - heck, it had everything I look for in any application. It was well thought out, well implemented and polished. It was well cared for by you, the developer - with regular and prompt attention to bug fixes. You take feature requests seriously, whereas many developers take them as a personal attack, and you do your best to implement those feature requests if they make sense to you as something worthwhile.

In short, it's not just the existing codebase, but your attention and relationship with your users that make XY so special and set it apart from most apps I have come across. That's what makes it worthwhile to go through what it takes to see dual pane implemented in XY. As much as I want dual pane, it's not worth having it bundled with an inferior application, inferior support, and inferior development.

Most things that are worthwhile take effort - and despite the obstacles, you've offered to make that effort as a developer. The least I can do is meet you halfway and make whatever effort I can contribute as a user to see this through. You and your program are worth the effort, and worth the wait (although, as a developer, you've already sold me - and I'll be purchasing a lifetime license later this week).

[admin]

Mesh,

help me stop my wondering: Why do you go into this labour of working out a Dual Pane Proposal for XY instead of using one of the numerous DP file managers that already exist?

Don

For years, I used PowerDesk. It was basic, but it served my needs. It finally reached the point earlier this year, where the bugs and lack of development and support tipped the balance and I decided it was time to find a new file manager.

I researched what's out there at the moment, and I looked into or evaluated most of the promising ones that appeared to have the features I wanted and needed (which included dual pane support). They all failed to meet my standards and requirements. The two most promising ones on my initial list were Directory Opus and Xplorer2.

Directory Opus had a lot of features, but they were not well implemented. Actions and behaviors that should have been intuitive, set by default, or easy to access instead took many people hours to find and use. And one of the dealbreakers for me was how it was set to run - unlike most other file managers, Directory Opus was not used as a standalone app. It was designed to always run in the background - this, to me, was a poor choice for the developers to make, and I was unwilling to use a file manager designed that way.

Xplorer2 seemed to be where I was heading - until I looked into it more closely. While it had an ambitious set of features, it was not well coded. There were a lot of bugs that should not have been there, and it lacked the polish of a well cared for application. When I came across a bit of information that the developer had lost interest in it as a project, this made sense to me. Clearly, it didn't make the cut - and it appeared to be set up to go the same route as Powerdesk.


So, I went back and looked at the second tier of my list - apps that looked promising, but didn't have the full set of features I was looking for. XY was on this list, and I'm extremely thankful that circumstances led me to evaluate it.

With the sole exception of dual pane, it had everything I wanted in a file manager - heck, it had everything I look for in any application. It was well thought out, well implemented and polished. It was well cared for by you, the developer - with regular and prompt attention to bug fixes. You take feature requests seriously, whereas many developers take them as a personal attack, and you do your best to implement those feature requests if they make sense to you as something worthwhile.

In short, it's not just the existing codebase, but your attention and relationship with your users that make XY so special and set it apart from most apps I have come across. That's what makes it worthwhile to go through what it takes to see dual pane implemented in XY. As much as I want dual pane, it's not worth having it bundled with an inferior application, inferior support, and inferior development.

Most things that are worthwhile take effort - and despite the obstacles, you've offered to make that effort as a developer. The least I can do is meet you halfway and make whatever effort I can contribute as a user to see this through. You and your program are worth the effort, and worth the wait (although, as a developer, you've already sold me - and I'll be purchasing a lifetime license later this week).

Thank you. Thanks a lot.

[j_c_hallgren]

XY was on this list, and I'm extremely thankful that circumstances led me to evaluate it.

With the sole exception of dual pane, it had everything I wanted in a file manager - heck, it had everything I look for in any application. It was well thought out, well implemented and polished. It was well cared for by you, the developer - with regular and prompt attention to bug fixes. You take feature requests seriously, whereas many developers take them as a personal attack, and you do your best to implement those feature requests if they make sense to you as something worthwhile.

In short, it's not just the existing codebase, but your attention and relationship with your users that make XY so special and set it apart from most apps I have come across. That's what makes it worthwhile to go through what it takes to see dual pane implemented in XY. As much as I want dual pane, it's not worth having it bundled with an inferior application, inferior support, and inferior development.

Mesh, that was a great reply! The parts that I feel most closely matches my feelings/situation are what I've quoted....and some of those are also reasons why I spend as much time here on this forum as I do (sometimes maybe a bit too much? ), because I realize how much Don puts into XY and I want to do whatever I can to help the cause...that includes the numerous hours that I've spent extracting the change logs into the blog, mainly to make it easier to access...and working to get XY some publicity in the media, and back on wikipedia, etc.

And yes, sometimes I've asked for things that later seem trivial/stupid, but I also think that by helping promptly welcome new members to forum, it makes them see how devoted a user base there is, and which may cause them to purchase it.

As I've written before, I'd like to have DP so that I wouldn't need to resort to X2 for those oddball times when I have to do some serious folder matching, and could thus stay in XY for almost all my file manager needs, so I'm happy that Mesh has spent as much time as he has (without getting ) on this "project".

[ReviewPilot]

Hi,

I have to agree with what Mesh says here, absolutely.

Regards, RP

[Fedorov]

Great post yes. I purchased XYplorer lifetime license more out of appreciation as I knew it would be very hard for me to move away from TotalCommander. I still check these forums almost daily and grab the latest beta version and I look forward to *any* dual-pane implementation that Don puts in v8 as I have confidence that I may be able to jump ship

[graham]

mesh wrote

Most things that are worthwhile take effort - and despite the obstacles, you've offered to make that effort as a developer. The least I can do is meet you halfway and make whatever effort I can contribute as a user to see this through. You and your program are worth the effort, and worth the wait (although, as a developer, you've already sold me - and I'll be purchasing a lifetime license later this week).

Good reply and saved the day, I feel for DP futures.

You describe exactly what XY is and more - the whole experience is a lot of fun and great to be a part of. As a side affect, one also gets a pretty remarkable file manager too!

[Mesh]

Thank you. Thanks a lot.

You're more than welcome. And as promised, I purchased a lifetime license this morning.

[admin]

Thank you. Thanks a lot.

You're more than welcome. And as promised, I purchased a lifetime license this morning.

Well done!

[Mesh]

Good reply and saved the day, I feel for DP futures.

You describe exactly what XY is and more - the whole experience is a lot of fun and great to be a part of. As a side affect, one also gets a pretty remarkable file manager too!

That's an absolutely delicious thought - that the file manager is a side effect of what we're purchasing. But there's definitely a grain of truth to that, I must say...

[Custer]

I am not going to go into a lengthy diatribe about why IMO XYplorer should remain focused with regards to the single/dual pane issue; I will only state my position by repeating a proverb:

[b]Jack of All Trades, and Master of NONE[/b].

Do any of you know about scotch, and the difference between single-malts and blendeds?

XYplorer is the BEST single-pane file manager.

For the 10% of the time you need dual-pane why not just use the BEST dual-pane file manager?

Single-pane and dual-pane file managers are two DIFFERENT beasts, yet some are determined to see the birth of some hybrid Frankenstein monster.

Why are some so eager to dilute this magnificent brand?!!

[Mesh]

Single-pane and dual-pane file managers are two DIFFERENT beasts, yet some are determined to see the birth of some hybrid Frankenstein monster.

Why are some so eager to dilute this magnificent brand?!!

Please. I seriously don't understand why people insist on treating these two features as seperately as they do, with so much hyperbole and so closed a mind to the needs of others. Single and dual panes are simply different modes of operation.

With your way of looking at it, you can also argue the best single tab and the best multi-tab file managers. Oh, oops - XY can do both.

Or the best mouse-only and the best keyboard functional file managers. Oh, oops again - XY can do both.


None of these combinations of modes makes XY a... what was it? Ah yes, a "hybrid Frankenstein monster". Well, the combination of single and dual pane modes won't do it either. It will have the same effect as the combination of other features listed above - it will make XY stronger, not weaker. Dual pane in no way detracts from the single pane functionality of XY. Users have the option to only use XY with a single tab if they prefer - or if they want, they can use multiple tabs. Or both. They can use only mouse driven commands, or they can use keyboard commands - or both. Well, the same thing holds true for dual and single pane. Having the ability to do one does not detract from the ability to use, or the features of the other.


All that aside, as I have said earlier in this thread - the discussion of whether to implement dual pane or not took place in another thread, and in another time. That issue has largely been dealt with. The purpose of *this* thread is to discuss *how* to implement dual pane - not whether or not to do so.

[Custer]

Mesh, it is obvious YOU ARE NOT A SOFTWARE DEVELOPER.
You can't understand because you are not someone who sits in isolation for hours coding, editing, testing, recompiling...

This man is an artist.

Imagine someone asking Picasso to paint a portrait for his daughter's wedding, saying "It doesn't look like her; as a great artist, can you paint something like a Michaelangelo?"

Can't you understand??

His HEART is not into dual-pane!

Everything that you have said about why you believe in XYplorer, the dedication, the focus, will NEVER be into a dual-pane implementation!

But you don't care about the artist's definition of reality, do you?