Improvements to tag organizing

[cadu]

One of the main features that bring me to XYplorer was "tag" and the powerful search engine that can associate tag with other parameters and file formats.

Besides documents, I deal heavy with multimedia (video, audio and image).

To tag image I use "XnView". To tag video and audio I use a SonyVegas plugin called "Media Manager".

I realize that XYplorer could be seen as a great multimedia organizing center, something like Adobe Bridge but much handy once it is an impressive "file manager" mainly!

However, so far I could use tagging it lacks in not provide a minimum "tag tree" structure. Considering intensive multimedia tagging (just photo should be enough), one level tag XYplorer get mess soon. Here there is a basic sample "tree tag" structure to photo. The "level" word it is just to highlight the tag tree, not a part of the tag name actually:

Tag level 1 - People
Subtag level 2 - Face
Subtag level 2 - Smile
Subtag level 2 - Body
Subtag level 2 - Eye
Subtag level 2 - Crew

Tag level 1 - Animal
Subtag level 2 - Wild
Subtag level 2 - Dogs
Subtag level 2 - Cats
Subtag level 2 - Birds

Tag level 1 - Landscape
Subtag level 2 - Montain
Subtag level 2 - Lake
Subtag level 2 - Forest

a) If XYplorer had a tag tree structure each tag level could be expanded and collapsed to show it subtags. This would provide handy ways to tagging and organizing data.

b) In the same way of the useful "catalog" panel XYplorer could provide a "tag tree" panel in which the files could be dragging and dropping to tagging. Handy, easy and fast tagging work.

These are organizing features that most of media or photo software has built-in. But I really would like to have all my organizing work in just one place => XYplorer.

I am new XYplorer user and maybe XYplorer already provide other ways of dealing with this issue.

Before choosing XYplorer I tried all this file manager software:

http://www.simplehelp.net/2006/10/11/10 ... d/#servsal

In overall features XYplorer is impressive already. And about tagging, XYplorer is the only one that provides a reasonable tag feature. It is a step ahead from the others. With tagging improvements XYplorer could indeed achieve other kind of users that want to organize their photos, images, graphs, movies, footage, music, composition, midi and so on. And tag is the way to deal with.

Ps.1: As an example the free software XnView has a good "tag tree" feature, although the search engine isn't good and can't be compare with XYplorer in any way.

Ps.2: It seems there are few (and weak) stand-alone commercial software to organize multimedia. About this kind of software that have a "file manager" look I know just MediaImpression 3 HD (ahttp://www.arcsoft.com/estore/software_title.a ... tCode=AMI3) which has a good tag structure, but on the other hand is weak in overall (the search and preview of XYplorer are better already). The free Xnview is even better than MediaImpression.

Best,
Cadu

[sfwood]

To accomplish what you are suggesting XYplorer would either need to implement it's own unlimited hierarchical tag/category system or would need to wade into the quagmire of efix/iptc/xmp image cataloging. I don't think a(nother) proprietary image cataloging system would generate any interest in the market and while it might be nice to have XY integrate existing metadata standards and methods into its tagging system, I wouldn't put this high on the list of desirable features. I use ACDSee, and have looked at XNview in some depth, and I know how much energy trying to integrate image metadata and cataloging (esp. hierarchical) has demanded of the developers of dedicated image management software. Now an efix pane and an iptc pane in the XY info panel would be nice, but that's a long way from what you're talking about, and I'm not sure wouldn't be a slippery slope. I say keep it fast and portable.

[cadu]

Hi,

Maybe I went so far in making comparison with media manager dedicated tools. Actually, I am not worrying about XYplorer provides all the information and resources of image/media cataloging. But my concern is just with XYplorer provides at least a way to organize tag into categories (multi-levels aren't really necessary a despite of a simulation I attached is showing it).

The current XYplorer one level tagging is difficult to handle when you have much tags and types of files to be tagging. So, considering the way XYplorer already provides tag, the feature of being possible to categorize the "tag list" (just two levels = category and tags into that category) and handle it through "list management/tag list" would be great!!! Nothing more than it...

Anyway, besides the sufficient improvement I mentioned above considering the current XYplorer structure, follow bellow some more advanced ideas:

In this way, the already available "catalog" area could provide a way to organize tags inside a category (so two levels would be available; it should be sufficient to achieve a better tag organization and handling). And since tags are available through "catalog", drag and drop to tagging should be handy as well.

Other possibility is to provide a tag area (at least with two levels = category and tags into that category) through a dedicated area/panel that shares the same place that "catalog". A button similar to "toggle information panel" could be available in "catalog" area. So, it would be possible to toggle between "catalog" area and "tag" area. Also, inside menu "window" could exist the selection "show tag categories", in the same way that "show catalog". As a simulation I created an image (attached) of XYplorer with a tag structure in the place of "calalog".

[eil]

why not make a separate catalog(another file) with categories as tag-groups and items as scripting commands, to tag dropped items with a certain tag? i think it would be pretty close to what you describe.

[cadu]

It sounds a good solution.
I could understand about providing "separate catalog(another file) with categories as tag-groups".
Actually, I am not familiarized with scripting commands yet. So, from here my understanding stopped!
Considering current XYplorer version, is it possible to be implemented by the user? Or is it an idea to future development?

[eil]

providing "separate catalog(another file) with categories as tag-groups".

by this i meant that catalog is saved in file, and you can make another catalog(another file) which will contain your desired "groups of tags" -so you'll be able to easily swap between some ordinary catalog and this tag-specific.
you can read about catalog handling in help file + you'll need to get knowledge about scripting command "tag"(search in help file will help).

one thing: currently drag'n'drop in catalog is used only for opening programs or files. at least i don't know how to make catalog to run script via d'n'd that will take action over file(but maybe someone else here knows ). so it can be like this: you chose files you wish to tag and you click over tag-item in catalog.

2012-03-19_214900.png (1.33 KiB) Viewed 3533 times

[cadu]

Many thanks for the tip. I am almost there! And I hadn't idea it could be possible through XYplorer. Great and flexible tool!

I could understand how to create a new catalog and categories. I also understood how to add an item as a scrip into catalog.

I would appreciate further help to:

a) In the example you gave me there is the script "face tag". May you provide me the syntax of this scrip considering it is set to add a tag to selected file(s)?

b)

Eil wrote: currently drag'n'drop in catalog is used only for opening programs or files. at least i don't know how to make catalog to run script via d'n'd that will take action over file(but maybe someone else here knows ). so it can be like this: you chose files you wish to tag and you click over tag-item in catalog.

=> Actually I don't need drag and drop feature if the tag can be applied in the selected items/files by clicking in the catalog/script. Then, should setting the scripts to add tag as wrote in (a) be sufficient to tagging selected files? Or should I implement anything more?

[eil]

after you right-clicked on category, selected Add New Item Here, named it, go to Properties. change nothing, but put this line in a field Location: tag "face",,1,1; this will set tag "face" to all selected items. !note: if there are any tags already assigned to selected items those will be lost = if you wish to keep them and instead add tags to already present, change last 1 to 0.
that's all. this catalog item will tag any selected files with "face" by clicking it. make same for others catalog items you may need.

[cadu]

Hi Eil. It worked great! Many thanks.
I have an adjustment question to the script.
I could see that any scripting tag is attached to files in despite of this tag have been created in List Management/Tag List.
So, creating scripting tag could cause some confusion when tag isn't related to List Management/Tag List.
a) Is there any way to improve the script to add the tag to the List Management/Tag List at first time a new tag is being applied?
b) Or should be easy first add the tag in List Management/Tag tree and after create the script with the same name of the tag created through List Management/Tag List?

[eil]

that's true. basically tag list is made for easier adding tags you may uses often, but it doesn't mean there must definitely be all tags there(i use some tags but didn't add them in list). still i understand your confusion.
i tried to improve script, but didn't succeed in preventing "clone tags"/checking if there is current tag already present in tag list(don't know if it's my lack of knowledge or currently it's kinda impossible).
i can advice you 2 things:
- manually adding tag to tag list before adding it to new catalog item;
- asking Don for enchantment of command taglist() with flags similar to tagsmode of command tag = that should allow easy adding tag to tag list when first assigned.

edited: frankly(but good for you) there appeared a same request here.

edit2: ok, Don made and enchantment in last beta(obviously you need to download it for this new feature to work).

Code: Select all

$t = "face";
  tag $t,,1,1;
  taglist($t,1);

you can copy this script at every catalog item you'll create, just change tag-word in quotes in first line. this will tag selected files + add tag to tag-list, if it wasn't there.
don't forget to say thanks for Don's work here.

edit3: here is your drop-taging script. tags selected files, adds tag to taglist(if first used), !note= takes tag-word from Caption field of catalog item. so item with "face" caption will tag files with "face"-tag.

Code: Select all

$tags = gettoken(self("caption")); 
  tag $tags, <get drop |> , 1, 1;
  taglist($tags,1);

[admin]

cadu, did you see this? Your original wish of a droppable tag tree has become reality:

Code: Select all

    + SC self enhanced: Added switch to return the caption of the 
      current script.
      Syntax: self(info)
        info:
          caption = caption of the current script
      Remarks:
        A script's caption is not part of the script itself but of its 
        container, e.g. a Catalog Item or a UDC.
      Example for a Catalog script that tags the dropped items taking 
      the actual tags (cats, dogs) from the caption of the script:
      Caption:
        Set tag to dropped items: cats, dogs
      Script:
        // Caption example = Set tag to dropped items: cats, dogs
          $tags = gettoken(self("caption"), 2, ":", "t"); 
          tag $tags, <get drop |> , 1;

FYI, you can also drop on a multi-script (which then will pop a menu) using the <get drop |> variable. self("caption") then refers to the caption of each script.

[LittleBiG]

Code: Select all

Example for a Catalog script that tags the dropped items taking
      the actual tags (cats, dogs) from the caption of the script:
      Caption:
        Set tag to dropped items: cats, dogs
      Script:
        // Caption example = Set tag to dropped items: cats, dogs
          $tags = gettoken(self("caption"), 2, ":", "t");
          tag $tags, <get drop |> , 1;

It won't tag anything. Maybe 1 instead of 2 in gettoken...

[admin]

You must set the caption like this:

Code: Select all

Set tag to dropped items: cats, dogs

Generally:

Code: Select all

<whatever>: <your tag(s)>

[LittleBiG]

You must set the caption like this:

Code: Select all

Set tag to dropped items: cats, dogs

Generally:

Code: Select all

<whatever>: <your tag(s)>

Thanks, now I understand. It is ok that way.

[Twisten]

Something still seems to be missing though, do we have a way to get the tag list of a specific file as a | separated list (instead of comma seperated) ?