Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Features wanted...
Mesh
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Joined: 24 Mar 2008 21:22

Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by Mesh »

admin wrote:
Okay, thanks everybody for his opinion. (But I won't change it. <duck>)

:)

Okaaaaay. So, how about making the pull down menus fully customizable? That way we can put it back ourselves, and save you the work! :mrgreen:

admin
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Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by admin »

Mesh wrote:
admin wrote:
Okay, thanks everybody for his opinion. (But I won't change it. <duck>)

:)

Okaaaaay. So, how about making the pull down menus fully customizable? That way we can put it back ourselves, and save you the work! :mrgreen:
How about using v8.40? :mrgreen:
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Mesh
Posts: 934
Joined: 24 Mar 2008 21:22

Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by Mesh »

admin wrote:
Mesh wrote:
:)

Okaaaaay. So, how about making the pull down menus fully customizable? That way we can put it back ourselves, and save you the work! :mrgreen:

How about using v8.40? :mrgreen:

Don't make me start pelting you with boy-band CDs...

:)

graham
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Joined: 24 Aug 2007 22:08
Location: Isle of Man

Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by graham »

I think maybe the problem is not where but the name Tools. If this was Settings then I think it could make more sense as that is a generic name covering view settings and config settings etc. Tools implies rather more than settings and you already have these as specials. So my view would be to have tools and settings as menu items.

Mesh
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Joined: 24 Mar 2008 21:22

Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by Mesh »

graham wrote:
I think maybe the problem is not where but the name Tools. If this was Settings then I think it could make more sense as that is a generic name covering view settings and config settings etc. Tools implies rather more than settings and you already have these as specials. So my view would be to have tools and settings as menu items.

I understand what you're saying. From my point of view, however, even Settings wouldn't quite be appropriate, as these items are still at least as View related as the remaining items under the View menu.

Putting them into a Settings menu might alleviate some of the sense of wrongness, but not the issue of it being unnecessarily seperated from the category it most closely falls under.

zer0
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Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by zer0 »

Without, hopefully, incurring any wrath, I am 100% with Mesh on this one. For me it was a "set it and forget it" type of situation until I had to deploy a build to another machine of mine. So, when I went into "View" (instinctively, this is where I'd go for fiddling with the way things are displayed) and didn't see "List Style" entry I thought you had get rid of it, seriously!

Eventually, I found it under "Tools" and it was sorted, but the way that it is not certainly takes way some of the intuition from XY's usage, which is important considering how customisable XY is. One way or another, I'd like to see those Tree/List Style and Columns' formats back under the "View" menu if at all possible. This is also for the sake of new users, and, in a way, I was one when I had to put a fresh copy of XY onto another computer :oops:
Reporting a bug? Have a wish? Got a question? Use search - View roadmap - FAQs: Forum + XY site
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grindax

Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by grindax »

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Last edited by grindax on 22 Jan 2016 15:50, edited 1 time in total.

Crash&Burn
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Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by Crash&Burn »

admin wrote:Okay, thanks everybody for his opinion. (But I won't change it. <duck>)
I had looked at XYplorer in the past. Lack of dual-pane made it a no-go. I notice that has recently been added; was looking around at the features and the changelog... (interesting stuff).

And then I run into this post by the developer that basically tells (what appears to be some of the main) key users at this forum he doesn't care what they think, the illogical change will remain as that's what he prefers.

I use a file-manager that allows complete customization of the MainMenu and Toolbar. And while that developer does things that are contrary to user-wishes at times or does not implement some things that seem to be high in demand - those contrary changes almost always come with .ini file options so people can retain previous functionality if they so wish.

This is a complete turn-off of what looked like a promising piece of software -- Even with the lack of sftp.
(Which again shows a very strange view in not even considering a plugin for WinSCP as it is third party.)

RalphM
Posts: 1429
Joined: 27 Jan 2005 23:38
Location: Cairns, Australia

Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by RalphM »

First of all, welcome to the forums, even though I gather from your post, you're not planning to stay, pity though.

I think it's a one-sided judgement of the developers responsiveness and willingness to implement user requests by taking into account just one single feature request.
Give it a bit more reading through the forum and I'm sure you'll see, he usually has some good reason, if he's stalling to give in too easy on a user request.
As for me (and I believe, many others) I'm more than happy with the support of this awesome piece of software.

Hope to see you back
Ralph :-)
(OS: W10 20H2 Home x64 - XY: Current beta - Office 2019 32-bit)

admin
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Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by admin »

Crash&Burn wrote:
admin wrote:Okay, thanks everybody for his opinion. (But I won't change it. <duck>)
I had looked at XYplorer in the past. Lack of dual-pane made it a no-go. I notice that has recently been added; was looking around at the features and the changelog... (interesting stuff).

And then I run into this post by the developer that basically tells (what appears to be some of the main) key users at this forum he doesn't care what they think, the illogical change will remain as that's what he prefers.

I use a file-manager that allows complete customization of the MainMenu and Toolbar. And while that developer does things that are contrary to user-wishes at times or does not implement some things that seem to be high in demand - those contrary changes almost always come with .ini file options so people can retain previous functionality if they so wish.

This is a complete turn-off of what looked like a promising piece of software -- Even with the lack of sftp.
(Which again shows a very strange view in not even considering a plugin for WinSCP as it is third party.)
You use another file manager, but register in this forum just to say that you are turned off about an absolute minor issue? Hilarious! I hope you feel better now. :lol:

Just to be very clear about this: I'm not Santa Claus. I'm not here to fulfill wishes. Every single feature in XYplorer is there because I think it's good. (With one single exception, Dual Pane, which I added because I thought it would increase publicity.)
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graham
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Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by graham »

And then I run into this post by the developer that basically tells (what appears to be some of the main) key users at this forum he doesn't care what they think, the illogical change will remain as that's what he prefers.
Clearly you have no experience of Don and his thinking regarding the future of XY. If, and it will never happen, Don were to go along with every user wish then XY would be totally out of control. If you spend time using XY rather than reading forum banter you will appreciate the thought that goes into crafting this wonderful software. There are many features in XY that are not to my personal taste but this is where Don has listened to users and does make well thought out judgements as to what is needed to meet file manager needs and cater for a wide variety of user wishes. I would say that scripting is a perfect example of meeting user wishes and it has been developing over a long time - if you are into programming then just have a go an appreciate the enormous scope of user specific tools available - few FM's have anything like this. I personally think it should be re-branded as XY programming rather than scripting as the latter implies makeshift simplistic user code.

With reference to your specific complaint, 'the illogical change' - well illogical to some and convenient to others - these are minor, insignificant issues and ones which may change as time goes by - Don is miles ahead of the forum in terms of what is coming along and what may seem illogical today is shown to be very logical later.

So, stop messing around, exploit XY and buy it before the price goes up!

admin
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Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by admin »

graham wrote:So, stop messing around, exploit XY and buy it before the price goes up!
A very wise tip... :wink:
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PeterH
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Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by PeterH »

I've just read this thread again...

- Mesh tells, for which reasons he thinks a change was bad for the interface of XY
- j_c says it's not sooo bad
- Mesh agains gives reasons for his opinion
- Demset says the same
- Don asks for other opinions
- serendipity and avsfan describe why they think the old version is better, and other ways to improve it
- j_c and Mesh accept idea of serendipity
- Don says "NO!" (With the reason "it's decided")
- some people wonder what's this
- Don seams to say "I hoped someone would say I'm right - but I won't change it"
- ...some more words...

Now think of someone not used to XY, when he reads this? What would you think he should think? I myself am here for some years, and find it strange...

OK - this is *not* what's going on here in most cases. And I don't mind RalfM of telling him this.

But Dons laughin "I hope you are feeling better now. :lol: "?
And Grahams "So stop messing around..."? followed by Dons "A very wise tip... :wink: "

Fom my point of view these statements were harder than those of Crash&Burn. I would say, this was not neccessary.

This is how i see it.

admin
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Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by admin »

OK, looks like my communication skills didn't rise up to the occasion this time. Sorry for that.

I think all this is more about words and habits and less about content. So here are my reasons for the decision:
(1) The Tools menu is traditionally the place in a Windows app for configuration stuff. (How it came to this is another question but not important here.)
(2) I try to put stuff where users are likely to look for it.
(3) I think these menus are about configuration (and most of the items here are "set and forget" = typical configuration stuff).

I say it's about words and habits because I think if (1) I renamed "List Style" to "List Configuration" or "Customize List" (etc.), and (2) it had always been as it is now, nobody would have a problem.
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j_c_hallgren
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Re: Please put the submenus back under the View Menu

Post by j_c_hallgren »

admin wrote:(2) I try to put stuff where users are likely to look for it.
If you're talking about users of other FM's who are converting over/comparing/dual-using, then this change may not be that true...I just did a brief check of x2 lite, XPlorer, FreeCommander, Q-Dir and A43 which are the other ones I have here for compare/reference (x2 is the only one I really ever use of these)...almost all have these type of options within the View menu...a couple don't really have a Tools menu...now that's nowhere near a comprehensive list but it does show the trend towards View and not Tools.

So while I agree many of these are "set & forget", I am becoming more convinced they are misplaced now than I was oriiginally...sorry. :(

Addendum: And even Opera browser has its similar options within View...
Still spending WAY TOO much time here! But it's such a pleasure helping XY be a treasure!
(XP on laptop with touchpad and thus NO mouse!) Using latest beta vers when possible.

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