With both Catalog and Tree shown, Shift+Tab reaches only one of them

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styrobrain
Posts: 4
Joined: 20 Jul 2020 12:35

With both Catalog and Tree shown, Shift+Tab reaches only one of them

Post by styrobrain »

When both Catalog and Tree are displayed, cycling the focus by hitting Shift+Tab reaches only one of them, the one that has been 'switched on' for longer; it skips the one that has been 'switched on' more recently.

I'm pretty sure this is a defect (I am aware of these threads but did not learn them by heart) and hasn't been reported yet. Feel free to correct me.

highend
Posts: 13274
Joined: 06 Feb 2011 00:33

Re: With both Catalog and Tree shown, Shift+Tab reaches only one of them

Post by highend »

Can't reproduce that behavior...
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styrobrain
Posts: 4
Joined: 20 Jul 2020 12:35

Re: With both Catalog and Tree shown, Shift+Tab reaches only one of them

Post by styrobrain »

After a bit more testing playing with it:
  • The problem (as I perceive it) occurs when, in the Configuration dialog, node "Tabs and Panes", "Dual Pane", the item "Tab key" is set to "Tab between both panes only", and both panes are shown.
  • The part that is skipped may be either one of (new here:) Address Bar, Catalog or Tree (given all three are visible). To reproduce, click two of them; the third is the one Shift+Tab will skip.
  • The List part is also skipped.
To approach the matter from a different angle (and broaden it a bit):
  • I see that when "Tab between both panes only" is set and both tabs are shown, the Shift+Tab order differs from the Tab order structure-wise (not just direction-wise).
  • I see that (then) Shift+Tab never brings the focus back to the List, but Tab does. My unreflected expectation would have been that Shift+Tab would visit the active List... but it makes sense the way it is. It is actually quite brilliant when compared to Directory Opus' default dual pane behaviour.
  • (But it seems inconsistent with other choices for "Tab key".)
  • But, to return to the original problem, I would (then) expect Shift+Tab to reach all non-List parts on display, though, and not just the two most recently visited.
  • (I would also expect Shift+Tab, when hit while the List has the focus, to move the focus to the same non-List part every time. Currently the focus seems to move to the non-List part that had it before it went to the List part. And that I find hugely annoying.)
Does this make sense, or should I unpack it a bit?
[Edit: fixed typo.]
Last edited by styrobrain on 03 Mar 2021 11:33, edited 1 time in total.

RalphM
Posts: 1932
Joined: 27 Jan 2005 23:38
Location: Cairns, Australia

Re: With both Catalog and Tree shown, Shift+Tab reaches only one of them

Post by RalphM »

I can't reproduce that behavior:
If "tab between panes only" is set, it only tabs between these two, with my usual setting of "tab through everything" it tabs through all the visible elements, so the reason for your problem must lay somewhere else.
Last edited by RalphM on 03 Mar 2021 14:13, edited 1 time in total.
Ralph :)
(OS: W11 22H2 Home x64 - XY: Current beta - Office 2019 32-bit - Display: 1920x1080 @ 125%)

styrobrain
Posts: 4
Joined: 20 Jul 2020 12:35

Re: With both Catalog and Tree shown, Shift+Tab reaches only one of them

Post by styrobrain »

RalphM wrote: 03 Mar 2021 05:09 I can't reproduce that behavior:
If "tab between panes only" is set, it only tabs between these two, with my usual setting of "tab through everything" it tabs through all the visible elements, so the reason for your problem most lay somewhere else.
Hm... you did notice that I'm clamoring about Shift+Tab, right? And not just Tab all by itself? And you noticed that the Shift+Tab order differs from the Tab order when "Tab between both panes only" is set and both panes are shown?

Here's another go on sorting the matter better. I describe it as it should be (for my taste anyway). When "Tab between both panes only" is set and both panes are shown:
  • Tab, when a List has the focus, moves the focus to the other pane's List. (Is so, am happy with it.)
  • Tab, when a non-List part has the focus, moves the focus to the active pane's List. (Is so, am happy with it.)
  • Shift+Tab, when a List has the focus, moves the focus to a visible non-List part (one of Address Bar, Catalog, Tree). Pane selection prevails. (Is so, am happy with it.)
  • When this happens, the part the focus moves to is literally foreseeable, either by a hardwired order among the non-List parts or by screen layout. (Currently it reflects previous navigation moves, which are of course not visible and thus don't indicate where the focus will go.)
  • Shift+Tab, when a non-List part has the focus, moves the focus to another non-List part. Pane selection prevails. (Is so, am happy with it.)
  • When this happens, all visible non-List parts can be reached by repeating Shift+Tab. (Currently I can only reach two of them. That is 'my original defect'.)
  • And also when this happens, the non-List part that receives the focus is literally foreseeable. (Currently it is determined by previous navigation moves and constricted by the defect.)
Getting there.

By "literally foreseeable" I mean: I can figure out what's going to happen just by looking at the screen.

If fixed properly, Tab could be (and can be already) thought of as the key for pane/List navigation and Shift+Tab could be thought of as the key (combination) for everything-else-navigation.

That. Would. Make. So. Much. Sense. And is probably the original intent anyway.

RalphM
Posts: 1932
Joined: 27 Jan 2005 23:38
Location: Cairns, Australia

Re: With both Catalog and Tree shown, Shift+Tab reaches only one of them

Post by RalphM »

For my taste way too much smartness built into a single tab or (reverse order) shift tab but good luck on your endeavor to make this become true.
I tried to help but I'm a mouse person, so over and out for me.
Ralph :)
(OS: W11 22H2 Home x64 - XY: Current beta - Office 2019 32-bit - Display: 1920x1080 @ 125%)

admin
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Re: With both Catalog and Tree shown, Shift+Tab reaches only one of them

Post by admin »

I move this to Wishes.

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