Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Features wanted...
tedy
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Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by tedy » 02 May 2016 20:58

When we copy/move items using the Custom Copy, if there is a collision we get a dialog Ask-ing us what to do (if so has been set up).
It would be good if there was an option to turn the dropdown choices into buttons so we can directly and fast act/resolve the collision with one click, similar to how the standard Windows collision-on-copy dialog allows us to cingle click to overwrite or keep both files.
The buttons could be in a column on the right. Maybe the most used commands only. This would be a great time saver. I don't happen to often resolve collisions but even in the minority of cases it is a real pain to choose from the dropdown every time when my choice is different from the last time.
The buttons could be made different in some aspect, for example the dangerous Overwrite can be in red font or something.

admin
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by admin » 04 May 2016 18:36

I think Overwrite should and will indeed be added.

eil
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by eil » 04 May 2016 20:44

Overwrite would be appreciated. hope positioning in dialog would be good.

tedy
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by tedy » 04 May 2016 20:49

I hope that you didn't mean only Overwrite will find a place as a direct button. Any chance that at least Suffix (e.g. file-01.txt) is another button in addition to Overwrite? :) I think those are most common in Windows (at least in Win7). I tend to almost always rename the file after the Suffix (or Keep Both Files) case anyways. And I can't remember whether I ever used any other option apart from Suffix and Overwrite - similar to ones in Windows default dialog.

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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by admin » 04 May 2016 20:54

eil wrote:Overwrite would be appreciated. hope positioning in dialog would be good.
Good point.

Probably the OK should go to the right of the dropdown. Not sure though:
Attachments
Overwrite.png
Overwrite.png (79.85 KiB) Viewed 1316 times

admin
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by admin » 04 May 2016 20:56

tedy wrote:I hope that you didn't mean only Overwrite will find a place as a direct button. Any chance that at least Suffix (e.g. file-01.txt) is another button in addition to Overwrite? :) I think those are most common in Windows (at least in Win7). I tend to almost always rename the file after the Suffix (or Keep Both Files) case anyways. And I can't remember whether I ever used any other option apart from Suffix and Overwrite - similar to ones in Windows default dialog.
Really? Not in Win8. Do you have a screenshot?

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DmFedorov
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by DmFedorov » 04 May 2016 23:36

I think there are two problems.
The first problem - i must select the desired string from the list.
The second problem - is a check-box.
--------
Both problems can be solved in principle by using keyboard shortcuts.
Imagine:
Before I click the button I press Shift.
This will mean that I clicked the checkbox.

If before pressing the button, I'll hold down some key, for example 1, 2, 3 ..., or z, x, c, v
It will mean that I have chosen some number from the list.

The last thing to do in this case - to confirm it somewhere in the window what I eventually chose.
This confirmation can be done with words or with the confirmation of my choice directly:

That is, you can directly show me that I put a tick and directly show me the selected string from the list.

If I see the correct confirmation I let go the button and the action will be performed.
If I see that made the wrong choice, it is logical if I change the keyboard shortcut.
---------------
I came up to this solution not himself.
I saw it in Directory Opus and it is very very convenient.
There confirmation has been done in the button that I push.
Here you can (if you clicked the shortcut key) just write on button OK something, such as "see your choice"

tedy
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by tedy » 05 May 2016 09:11

Don, I'm still with Win7, there you have Keep Both Files (Windows adds a eventually number-suffixed "-copy" to the filename) and Overwrite (and Cancel of course).
I think in the proposed screenshot the buttons (and the Action dropdown/checkbox) could be grouped better.
The way I see it currently is attached. I realize that this way it might be confusing for the user - the buttons group on the left could be labelled appropriately that it acts directly, ignoring the dropdown choice (and OK button).

I didn't quite understand DmFedorov. Pressing a direct button ignores completely what's selected in the dropdown. Simple as that.

Edit: Well, the checkbox could be emphasized (moved at the bottom) that it is always honored.
xy_customcopy_resolution.png
xy_customcopy_resolution.png (37.19 KiB) Viewed 1284 times
another mock-up
xy_customcopy_resolution1.png
xy_customcopy_resolution1.png (35.97 KiB) Viewed 1282 times
something like that.

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DmFedorov
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by DmFedorov » 05 May 2016 10:22

I didn't quite understand DmFedorov. Pressing a direct button ignores completely what's selected in the dropdown. Simple as that.
I have said: Imagine
I have said: before pressing the OK button, I'll hold down some key

and in this case you will see your choice: you will see checkbox-choice and your choice in List, and in OK-button you will see e.g. "See your choice".
After it you can press OK-button that is now "See your choice".

If you can't imagine this - you can open such (Directory Opus) dialog and see how it have worked there.

tedy
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by tedy » 05 May 2016 10:52

Now I read your previous post and I have made more sense of it.
This is not a bad approach, holding some modifier you can see (temporarily) checked checkbox and chosen action from the dropdown (or the OK button changing its label to the appropriate choice), but I think this adds to already complicated behaviors of XY. You have thousands of similar shortcuts all over XY for different tasks and most people wouldn't remember the shortcuts for this relatively rare case of resolving such collisions, and would instead just use the old and "safe" way by working with the list itself.
Also, you are limited in modifiers, only four, you have the checkbox occupy one of them, and using numbers corresponding to a choice in the dropdown list is anything but intuitive IMO. Using letters could be fine if they were easy to reach one-hand and correspond to the choice (e.g. (Ctrl+)Shift+O for Overwrite with the checkbox checked - not handy). Also I tend to forget kbd shortcuts I use seldom, fast. Win7 has the two most common cases directly in the dialog with big buttons/areas for a reason, it has no other options than Cancel, but they were chosen well. I might as well revert to the windows copy, it served me well for 7-8 years. I turned on Custom Copy a while ago after a new bug was introduced when using Windows copy, but it was fixed fast. I kept using Custom Copy for its rich set of info but it's not that critical, also it has other bugs when copying to a flash drive - it stops responding and dims for long time after reaching 99%, while the big OS cache is being written to the flash drive. No such issue with the standard copy.
Nevertheless, using sensibly crafted keyboard aids for this could be the finest solution.
Having buttons enables you to use direct shortcuts to activate the button - Alt+O would directly activate Overwrite without even involving the mouse. Or with the mouse - without engaging the left hand. I mean buttons at least for the most commonly used two or three actions (user selectable in the best scenario).

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DmFedorov
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by DmFedorov » 05 May 2016 11:06

With Keyboard shortcut I must make only one click - on button OK.
And the number of clicks is target.

In this case you will see keyboard-shortcut tips, and you can make it not only for OK-button, but also for Skip-button.

How it was in Opus
(In XY it will better - you will see the choice direct in dialog, if Don will make it)
Attachments
(05.05.2016 10_54_40).gif
(05.05.2016 10_54_40).gif (17.22 KiB) Viewed 1276 times

tedy
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by tedy » 05 May 2016 14:25

Looking at the screenshot, being able to directly rename (write the new name) of the new file in the dialog itself, seems appealing.

Another hint from the screenshot - the OK button could have a dropdown itself, where you can choose the action directly, with two clicks instead of three as is now (click to open the dropdown, click to choose an option, then click OK button).

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DmFedorov
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by DmFedorov » 05 May 2016 15:08

Yes. It was screenshot of 2010 year.

Don is very canny. He can make so, that Keyboard shortcuts for (OK, or Skip) buttons will work only when I hover it.
And he can make so that check-box will always react on Shift-key automatically.
Another hint from the screenshot - the OK button could have a dropdown itself
In this case Don must remake dialog, else there will be two lists to selection.

But sense of using Keyboard shortcuts is using such selection one time, not permanent.

Keyboard shortcuts version is only one click action, not three or two clicks.

tedy
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by tedy » 05 May 2016 15:19

DmFedorov wrote:In this case Don must remake dialog, else there will be two lists to selection.
It was obvious that if Don implements a OK-dropdown, he would remove the other dropdown.
DmFedorov wrote:..And he can make so that check-box will always react on Shift-key automatically.
Of course he can do all this, the question is how to make things easy for everyone to act on and remember, and with minimum of efforts.
DmFedorov wrote:Keyboard shortcuts version is only one click action, not three or two clicks.
One click but combined with keyboard clicks/presses - this counts as well. A real one-clicker is when there are buttons as I suggested initially. They can be in addition to any other aids Don might decide to implement. I would use the buttons with no doubt, maybe with an optional kbd modifier for the checkbox.
The idea for a on-hover dropdown on the OK button is also plausible in order to decrease the number of clicks.

eil
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Re: Custom Copy: direct actions buttons on collisions

Post by eil » 05 May 2016 15:55

admin wrote:Probably the OK should go to the right of the dropdown. Not sure though:
my idea might be not popular judging that most people here try to bring even more buttons, but i will try.

i see it like this(probably less distance between buttons).
xy_customcopy_new.png
xy_customcopy_new.png (33.24 KiB) Viewed 1248 times
- check mark doesn't need that long description
- OK next in line after drop-down looks logical = you made a decision and approve it
- Cancel is on far left as it's the least used button
- only Overwrite and Skip 'cause eventually collision comes to 3 situations: need to overwrite, skip or custom variant = as i remember XYcopy keeps the last choice of drop-down as default on next appearance, so every user will have his custom variant intact, no reason to add lots of buttons.

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